what supplement manufacturers do you use?

my current favorites are now foods and doctor's best, for value and quality. What do you think of these? The only ones I avoid are life enhancement(there vinpocetine was ineffective for me, and i read that tests of their huperzine a revealed 0 active incredient, and solgar.

Finding little or no active ingredient is a common result when dietary supplement products are tested at independent laboratories. Other times, they have WAY too much of the active ingredient...which can lead to toxicity and even death in some cases...

In fact, the latest Consumerlab.com test found that one DHEA supplement that was tested contained no DHEA. Another one tested contained 215% of its expected amount of DHEA. So, out of 11 tested, 2 totally failed the tests. That's ~18% failure. That's horrible.

In fact, if you have taken 20 supplements randomly purchased at your local vitamin shop in the USA, the evidence suggests you might have been contaminated with deadly chemicals, such as lead and cadmium.

LEAD is "big brain" kryptonite

If you choose to take any supplements from a vendor who is not listed at consumerlab.com (AND is able to consistently match their label claims)...ask them to provide you with evidence that they use reputable suppliers that use DRUG GMPs, NOT Food GMPs -- or, if they sell nootropics, ask them to provide you with some evidence that they test their products for purity and contaminants at FDA registered laboratories. The best way to do this: request COAs (Certificates of Analysis). If a vendor falters to provide you with a COA (even when you kindly request one), if you choose to do business with them, you do so at your own health's risk...and you can't say you weren't warned.

Many vendors in the supplement market use suppliers and have messages on COAs that say that the COA is only for "informational purposes and is not intended as a substitute for strict quality control analysis by the purchaser of the product." You bet that the companies that won't provide you with the COA, or have no company name on the COA are most likely in it to "make a buck" and don't care about your health...they want their wallets to expand, and that's about it.

Some companies that have not had contamination and are able to match their label claims (as far as I know, correct me if I am wrong, CL members) are LEF (Life Extension Foundation) and Jarrow.

To my own defense: I don't sell finished product at this time, I only sell raw materials and use companies with WHO certification or companies that implement drug GMPs. (Sabinsa Corp., GeroNova Inc. and American Lecithin Company).

To see the whole rant on supplement impurities, click here

The bottom line; Join Consumerlab.com.

Edited by nootropikamil, 14 September 2006 - 06:03 AM.

Click HERE to rent this advertising spot for SUPPLEMENTS (in thread) to support LongeCity (this will replace the google ad above).

Now foods

What about AOR? I limit my purchases to LEF and AOR.

I find it very convenient to know products are tested and pass consistently at Consumerlab.com.

I can't say: "well, every other brand except AOR should get CL approval because AOR is special." That would degrade the credibility of my statement: "only buy from companies that pass tests at CL.com" and also would sound ridiculous. Companies should be treated equally -- AOR is for profit and is a dietary supplement company and is not at CL.com. We can't pretend they are. I don't think AOR would use suppliers that would provide substandard product...however...more proof is always better than less.

Relentless Improvement performs independent testing to certify purity of their name brand products. They prove it by making COAs publicly downloadable.

I've requested COAs (in this forum) from AOR and they have provided them. If you take AOR products, you can request COAs and perhaps check what companies provide raw materials for them and check that companies GMPs. I'd be pleased if ALL supplement companies simply make ALL of their COAs publicly downloadable...and if they choose not to, they should understand consumers desire for third party purity quantification by CL.com.

I think AOR should get their products on US store shelves so they get tested by CL.com..or join CL's Voluntary Certification Program:

Voluntary Certification Program:
Manufacturers and distributors interested in the potential of having their products certified by CL, listed among the Approved Quality Products in CL's Product Reviews and bear the CL Seal may participate in the Voluntary Certification Program. Testing is conducted in the same manner as Product Reviews with test samples not accepted directly from the manufacturer.

There is a testing fee paid by the manufacturer and results are proprietary to the manufacturer. However, if a product "Passes," it will appear in CL's Web site listing of the respective Product Review and is also eligible to carry the CL Seal of Approval upon acceptance by the manufacturer of the CL Seal Use License Agreement (described below).

Due to economies of scale, testing fees are lower for products that fall within a category about to undergo a Product Review. Manufacturers and distributors should contact lisa.sabin@consumerlab.com if they wish to be alerted to upcoming Product Review categories.

I might join CL's Raw Material & Private Label Certification Program if I decide to sell a raw material from a supplier without all the QC I need. However, it's probably cheaper, in many cases -- to set up the testing myself...and just make the results public...

Edited by nootropikamil, 14 September 2006 - 09:07 AM.

I like NSI.

Also, I am 100% cofident I've come across fake zinc before! I was able to tolerate 125 mg in one dose with no side effects! With another brand I get nausea (in some cases vomiting) from 50 mg.

I use:

Jarrow
Now Foods
Source Naturals
Doctor's Best
NSI

I order most of my supplements from Beyond A Century. They have very high quality products at very low prices (especially for their uncapped products).

I am very wary of CL. I think the concept of having a supplement watchdog is important. However, I know that company's who join CL's certification program will never have a failed product report published as long as they continue to pay thousands of dollars to CL. It's organized blackmail, IMO.

I recently ordered from puritan's pride, and was very dissapointed. Their ginkgo was totally ineffective for me, it felt as if I stopped taking ginkgo. Anyone have an opinion on them?

I am very wary of CL. I think the concept of having a supplement watchdog is important. However, I know that company's who join CL's certification program will never have a failed product report published as long as they continue to pay thousands of dollars to CL. It's organized blackmail, IMO.

Huh, where is your evidence for this?

I recently ordered from puritan's pride, and was very dissapointed. Their ginkgo was totally ineffective for me, it felt as if I stopped taking ginkgo. Anyone have an opinion on them?

I ordered from them a long time ago when I was short on money and I think their products are not the greatest. Their melatonin was ineffective so I kind of judged everything else by that fact and vowed not to use them again. They're impossibly cheap anyway. You get what you pay for.

I use a lot of different brands including:

LEF
Solgar (my first choice in vitamins)
Jarrow
Now
TwinLab
Country Life
Natrol (not my first choice but the best at the drugstore)
KAL (excellent magnesium glycinate)
Gaia Herbs
MRM
Vitamin Shoppe

There's more but these are the main ones.

Huh, where is your evidence for this?

An excellent question.

I think these four pretty much lead the pack:

LEF
AOR (from Pete)
New Chapter
Brownwood Farms

If these first four don't have what I'm looking for, then I'll branch out into the others that people have listed about. But I ALWAYS look to these four first. New Chapter especially, seems to fly under the radar, but everything I've read about them has convinced me this is one high-quality, morally conscious company that really cares about health improvement. (www.newchapter.info)

I also get a lot of prescription-type stuff from Antiaging Systems (www.antiaging-systems.com), like Deprenyl, Glucobay, Aminoguanidine and Metformin. Always reliable.

New Chapter is a good choice especially for the morially conscious consumer.

My choice is generally bang-for-buck supps because cost is an issue. Hence my favorites are: Jarrow and NOW Foods

Off Topic:

Duke: if you are taking Glucobay (I have not investigated this -- just googled and saw it's an anti diabetic drug), you might want to take a look at another drug currently in development by GlaxoSmithKline: it's called Avandia® (rosiglitazone maleate).

The only caveat is the fact that GSK funded this trial. Obviously, such results will need to be corroborated by an independent NIH funded trial before they can be taken seriously. These results are absolutely amazing; this drug might perhaps be the biggest breakthrough in slowing and/or stopping the onset of type II diabetes.

A quote:

and additive to standard counseling on healthy eating and exercise[/u], which was provided to all participants in the trial. The results of the landmark study are being reported today both in The Lancet and at the 42nd annual meeting of the European Association for the Study of Diabetes (EASD).

The DREAM (Diabetes REduction Assessment with ramipril and rosiglitazone Medication) trial evaluated the likelihood of progression to type 2 diabetes over a three-year median follow-up period among 5,269 participants with a condition known as "pre-diabetes". In pre-diabetes, blood sugar levels are higher than normal but not yet high enough for a diagnosis of type 2 diabetes. Participants included in the study were randomized to rosiglitazone (8 mg daily) or placebo and to ramipril (15 mg daily) or placebo and were assessed every six months for three to five years to determine if rosiglitazone or ramipril can reduce the risk of developing type 2 diabetes in individuals with pre-diabetes, when added to healthy eating and exercise counselling. The DREAM study was not designed as a direct comparison between rosiglitazone and ramipril. Results from the ramipril arm of the study, which increased regression to normoglycemia but did not reduce the risk of diabetes or death, are also being reported at EASD and published separately in New England Journal of Medicine.

In this study, designed and conducted by the Population Health Research Institute at McMaster University, Canada, 10.6 percent of participants receiving rosiglitazone progressed to type 2 diabetes versus 25 percent of participants treated with placebo. In the composite primary endpoint of development of diabetes or death from any cause, rosiglitazone demonstrated a 60 percent risk reduction relative to placebo (p<0.0001).

Back on topic:

Realizing that I went a bit of topic, to answer the question inferred by the topic name...I take about 40-50 different "dietary supplements" on a daily basis. At this time, I encapsulate everything myself except for a few (at this time, L-carnosine, Methyl-B12, COQ10...I think that's it...now I get these from Jarrow and I also buy their inositol powder, which I encapsulate myself as well). If my entire stack was pre encapsulated, my annual supplement budget would cost me about 5-10X as it does at this time.

is puritan's pride really that terrible? i had order a larger amount of lecithin triple strength from them thinking of the current offers they have and are currently waiting for my stuff to arrive.

Puritan pride is ok if you're not looking for latest hype. They don't have some advanced products like others, but that they have is of good quality. Specially lecithin, it easy to make so which ever lecithing you buy it should be ok.

Huh, where is your evidence for this?

An excellent question.

While this was the most high profile case. I've heard that what CRN claimed is true. I don't think this case actually proved anything though.

http://www.ffnmag.co...icleDisplay.asp

In January, CRN filed a complaint with the Federal Trade Commission alleging that ConsumerLab, an independent tester of dietary supplements, engages in deceptive business practices by only publishing positive results of those companies that pay to have their products tested. For companies that don’t pay, negative results are highlighted and positive results are withheld.

“We are not opposed to third-party testing,” said Annette Dickinson, president of CRN. “We are opposed to this kind of business model. ConsumerLab is a business, not a watchdog — and one that intimidates manufacturers to pay for its services. We’ve heard complaints about their manner of operation for many years, but until recently, we didn’t have a complete understanding. Now, we have seen actual contracts, discussed it with our board, and received legal advice that the best way to seek a correction is to file an FTC complaint.”

http://www.annieappl...mtoftcagco.html

Here is how it works: ConsumerLab.com approaches dietary supplement makers requesting that they enroll in its "voluntary" testing program-for a fee. Those that pay are guaranteed that products failing the subsequent testing will not be identified publicly. Companies that do not pay risk having their products tested anyway and, if they fail, being publicized on ConsumerLab.com's Web site and in the media.

thanks, any other has experience on Puritan pride?

I've used them. They seem fine.

which products have you tried?

jagged: The cases you illustrated above I covered in an earlier topic.

I'll repost most of my reply here, for simplicity. Also: See this post.

Of course companies want to protect their image, so they often try to fight the results that prove they aren't able to match their label claim or have contaminated products. The most recent was this (this is very recent too):

May 18, 2006 — Court denies vitamin trade group's motion to stop defamation suit brought by ConsumerLab.com

COURT DENIES VITAMIN TRADE GROUP'S MOTION TO STOP DEFAMATION SUIT BROUGHT BY CONSUMERLAB.COM

WESTCHESTER COUNTY, NEW YORK — MAY 18, 2006 (UPDATED APRIL 7, 2006) — ConsumerLab.com announced that the Supreme Court of the State of New York has denied a motion by a trade group of vitamin and supplement makers to dismiss the defamation suit brought against it by ConsumerLab.com. The trade group, which calls itself the Council for Responsible Nutrition (CRN), had argued that the alleged defamatory remarks were shielded from suit and privileged because they related to a letter sent by it to the Federal Trade Commission (FTC). Justice Kenneth W. Rudolph ruled on Tuesday that no such privilege applied.

ConsumerLab.com has been at the forefront of exposing problems with vitamins and supplements in the U.S. since its founding in 1999 by Tod Cooperman, M.D. and former FDA scientist William Obermeyer, Ph.D. In what ConsumerLab.com considers a malicious smear campaign designed to undermine its credibility, CRN distributed a press release in January 2005 publicizing a letter that it simultaneously sent to the FTC alleging that ConsumerLab.com violated the FTC Act. CRN entitled its letter "Enforcement Action against ConsumerLab.com," creating the false impression that the FTC was involved in an action, which was never the case. The news release and letter were rife with false and misleading information about ConsumerLab.com. The FTC refused to take action with respect to CRN complaint, issuing a "no action" letter.

"We were pleased when the FTC exposed this trade group's accusations as no more than a baseless smear campaign and we are again pleased that the State Supreme Court has allowed our case against this group and its former president to proceed to trial," said Dr. Cooperman. "Consumers deserve to know the truth about what is in, or not in, the supplements they take. Our voice will not be silenced."

Tod Cooperman, M.D., President of ConsumerLab.com, advised that while melatonin is generally safe, it is a hormone and its use should be discussed with a healthcare practitioner. It can cause drowsiness for several hours after use and can interfere with some drugs, such as blood pressure medication.

ConsumerLab.com has tested more than sixteen hundred vitamins and supplements. It has found problems with over one quarter of the products it has selected for testing. ConsumerLab.com's reports are available through its popular subscription-based website www.consumerlab.com, which receives over two million visits per year, and in its acclaimed book ConsumerLab.com's Guide to Buying Vitamins and Supplements: What's Really in the Bottle?

ConsumerLab.com has no ownership from, or interest in, companies that manufacture, distribute, or sell consumer products. Subscription to ConsumerLab.com is available online.

Consumerlab.com merely "reports" on the results of independent testing results; and many companies have had to deal with the hard core truths that their products can't meet their label claim due to the fact that they cannot... The dietary supplement market is renown for having crappy quality as a whole; so that's not exactly news .

To see all of their results:

http://www.consumerl.../news/index.asp

Consumer Labs has been around since 1999 and has been protecting folks since then. I am sure they will stick around.

FTC DISMISSES COMPLAINT BY VITAMIN TRADE GROUP AGAINST CONSUMERLAB.COM

WHITE PLAINS, NY — March 15, 2005 — ConsumerLab.com has announced that the United States Federal Trade Commission (FTC) sent a letter today to a trade group of vitamin and supplement makers, which calls itself the Council for Responsible Nutrition (CRN), stating that the FTC refused to take action with respect to a complaint by the group against ConsumerLab.com.

ConsumerLab.com is a leading independent evaluator of health and nutrition products and has been at the forefront of exposing problems with vitamins and supplements in the U.S. since 1999 when it was founded by Tod Cooperman, M.D. along with former FDA scientist William Obermeyer, Ph.D. ConsumerLab.com's mission is to help consumers identify better quality products.

In what ConsumerLab.com considers a malicious campaign designed to undermine its credibility, the trade group CRN distributed a press release in January publicizing a letter that it simultaneously sent to the FTC alleging that ConsumerLab.com violated FTC code. CRN entitled its letter "Enforcement Action against ConsumerLab.com," creating the false impression that the FTC was involved in an action, which was never the case. The news release and letter were rife with false and misleading information about ConsumerLab.com.

"We are glad that the FTC has exposed this trade group's actions as no more than a baseless smear campaign intended to discredit our findings and silence an independent voice," commented Dr. Cooperman, ConsumerLab.com's president. "Rather than shoot the messenger, it is time that this group heed the message that consumers deserve to know what is in, or not in, the supplements that they take." ConsumerLab.com will be commencing legal action against CRN and its executives for its defamatory attack.

ConsumerLab.com in the News

ConsumerLab.com appreciates the coverage it has received from many news organizations including those listed below.

Newspapers:
Boston Globe, Chicago Sun-Times, Chicago Tribune, Gannett News Service, Investor's Business Daily, Minneapolis Star Tribune, Newsday, New York Post, Pittsburgh Post-Gazette, Reno Gazette-Journal, San Francisco Chronicle, The Arizona Republic, The Atlanta Constitution, The Atlanta Journal-Constitution, The Baltimore Sun, The Christian Science Monitor, The Detroit Free Press, The Hartford Courant, The Journal News, The Los Angeles Times, The New York Times, The Oregonian, The Orlando Sentinel, The Seattle Times Magazine, The Tampa Tribune, The Wall Street Journal, The Washington Post, USA Today, and Wilmington Morning Star.

Magazines:
Arthritis Today, Better Homes and Gardens, Business Week, Cooking Light, Fitness Magazine, Glamour Magazine, Health Magazine, HerbalGram, Herbs for Health, Kiplinger's Personal Finance, Ladies' Home Journal, Men's Health, Modern Maturity, Money Magazine, Mother Earth News, New Choices Magazine, Newsweek International, O the Oprah Magazine, Parade, Prevention Magazine, Pure Power, Magazine Protégez-Vous, Reader's Digest, Remedy Magazine, Runners World, Self, Shape, Time, USA Weekend, U.S. News and World Report, and Vegetarian Times

Newsletters:
AARP Bulletin, Bottom Line Health, Bottom Line Personal, Cosmetics Cop Newsletter, Dr. Andrew Weil's Self Healing Newsletter, Environmental Nutrition, Nutrition Action Newsletter, The Johns Hopkins Medical Letter — Health After 50, The Tufts University Health & Nutrition Letter, Townsend Letter for Doctors and Patients, and the UC Berkeley Wellness Letter

Radio:
"Eye on the Internet" KRLD 1080/Dallas-Fort Worth, Focus on the Family with Dr. James Dobson, The People's Pharmacy (Public Radio), and WOR HealthTalk with Dr. Hoffman

Television:
ABC News 20/20, CBS Evening News with Dan Rather, CNN Headline News, and NBC Today Show and Weekend Today Show.

Trade & Professional Publications:
American Journal of Nursing, Complementary Practice of Alternative Medicine, Drug Store News, Food Labeling and Nutrition News, Functional Foods, Health Supplement Retailer, Journal of Practical Psychiatry, NACDS Chain Pharmacist Practice Memo, Natural Business, Natural Pharmacy, Nutraceuticals World, Nutritional Outlook, Primary Psychiatry, Psychiatric Annals, The Tan Sheet, Today's Dietician, Today's Health & Wellness, U.S. Pharmacist, Vitamin Retailer Magazine, and Whole Foods.

Books:
"Nutrition Concerns in Women" by Sarah Johnston Miller, Pharm.D., BCNSP appearing in the American College of Clinical Pharmacy's Pharmacotherapy Self-Assessment Program version IV, 2002.
The Wellness Revolution, Paul Zane Pilzer, John Wiley & Sons, 2002.
Nutritional Aspects and Clinical Management of Chronic Disorders and Diseases, Edited by Felix Bronner, CRC Press, 2002.

And the list keeps growing!

Edited by nootropikamil, 19 September 2006 - 06:44 PM.

A one year membership to Consumerlab.com is only $27. Many folks around here spend over $1,000 per year on supplements -- making $27 a good investment to know that you get what you pay for.

Click here to join.

I might start a new organization to compete with Consumerlab.com...it looks to be profitable. I think it would be a good idea to make all the labs I use and results publicly available. I think one of the reasons ConsumerLab.com does not make their test results publicly available is the fact that they want to protect the independent labs from getting harassed by the supplement manufacturers trying to squeeze every penny out of us....

Too bad ConsumerLab.com does not test nootropics.

I try to go with AOR and gerenova whenever possible. I usually go through pete at relentless for my orders.

as they say in ebonics......the mofo be da shiznit fo real yo. I ain't frontin.

my oders are shipped promptly and oftentimes with aesthetically pleasing cards as well.

I think my last one had a degas on the front if I remember correctly.

anyone has experience on using pritan pride products before? care to comment?

I've used and I'm using Puritan pride for years. They're cost effective supplements. For basic stuff like fish oils, vitamin c, minerals and nothing really advanced they're great and cheap.

theres alot of threads on this.

as far as i know, puritans pride is a sub par brand... ie: they do not use pharma grade ingredients, or do 3rd party assaying of their products. nor do they hand out assays of their products. i believe someone tried to get an assay of their fishoil, and was refused.

its been my expirience between buying & selling, dealing with companies, collecting COA's from companies, and getting inside info in some of the quality control processes & origins of the supplements (most companies dont make their own vitamins)... that there is a huge difference between what i would consider the better quality companies, and what i would consider the average companies. the supplement world is nearly completely unregulated, and in truth its left mostly up to the morals & ethics of the owners/shot callers to decide just how stringent their quality control is. be assured that if you buy cheap brands, you are putting the left overs of unpure extraction methods & unexact chemical synthesis into your body, and even though it may only be a small amount. small amounts over long periods of time, will cause harm.

markers of good quality supplement companies: only uses pharma grade ingredients & has 3rd party verification that the ingredients are actually as such. freely hands out the 3rd party verification. will gladly talk to you about their quality controll processes.

good examples of what REAL quality control is:

http://www.purecaps....lityControl.asp
http://www.reliancev...om/quality.html
http://www.enzy.com/about/quality.asp
http://www.gaiaherbs...chure.php?id=17



best quality:

aor
pioneer nutriutional
enzymatic therapy
thorne
pure encapsulations
jarrow (who buys nearly all their stuff from aor)
reliance vitamin
gaia herbs
new chapter
banyan botanicals



good quality:

lef
now foods
source naturals

Edited by ajnast4r, 30 September 2006 - 08:36 PM.

Click HERE to rent this advertising spot for SUPPLEMENTS (in thread) to support LongeCity (this will replace the google ad above).

AOR, Solgar, NOW Foods, Jarrow. And occasionally other brands for herbals like saw palmetto tincture.