Safest solution for ADHD?

Brain stimulants were working great for my adhd but they were causing me some serious problems: tips on the tong, jaw and teeth problems (as meth users but at a lower scale), rosacea and obviously sleep problems.

I am a diagnosed case of severe ADHD, very similar to your description; I'm a computer engineer and I went to my doctor because I was just unable to work. I did not try Strattera but all of the other, sometimes mixed. According to readings and scientific evidences, I would say that modafinil is the safest. According to my personal experience it’s the worst, so many side effects that I just can’t stand it. Before nootropics, my regimen was Adderall 30mg + Ritalin 60mg.

Have you ever come across any studies on the possible long term affects of stimulant usage? It seems that while these have been studied for many decades, all of the research has been done on short term affects, at least from what I have seen. I'm also wondering, from all of the readings and evidences that you have come across pointing to modafinil as the safest, is the reasoning behind that cardiac related, or is there more?

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Not necissarily, but dystonic and parkisonian type syndromes have been proposed as either damage to the basal ganglia or an overdrive of aceytlcholine or noradrenaline in the same area. If you go by the dynamic developmental theory of attention-deficit/hyperactivity disorder then increasing aceytlcholine to great amounts may have an effect on movement. I, however, was taking an anti-psychotic about 6 months ago for about a month, and this in itself messed with my dopaminergic system making me ever so sensitive to cholinergics. I will say that before taking this devilish pill that i was sensitive to cholinergics to begin with and this just worsened the issue. I mean even now i still suffer from drug-induced parkinsonism like symptoms. Hopefully these will go away.....

I really hope they will to. I’m yeast curious now, I hope you don’t mind me asking, but do you now how you react to nicotin? dos it immediately stop the parkinsonism like symptoms?

I hade no idée that tobacco had such a significant effect on the nerve system, before reading nightlight posts. it almost appears as if its a superior analog to acetylcholine, and that the smoker actually upgrade his nerve system.

narcissisistic: cigarettes are wavy with me. Overall i do get an enhanced cognition but i m not exactly sure about my coordination. I have tried to assess myself from time to time and honestly it seems as if it has worsened them (my conditions). Most of the time i smoke cigarettes when i have a drink or two, so the alcohol has an effect on my movement and is hard to assess fully. Cigarettes, i will say, do help with depression and some ADHD symptoms if you continue to smoke them for a couple of weeks daily. I also highly recommend against this.

narcissisistic: cigarettes are wavy with me. Overall i do get an enhanced cognition but i m not exactly sure about my coordination. I have tried to assess myself from time to time and honestly it seems as if it has worsened them (my conditions). Most of the time i smoke cigarettes when i have a drink or two,

It seems your biochemical networks have sensed the therapeutic properties of tobacco smoke in countering some damaging effects of alcohol. In addition to the immediately perceivable reduction in cognitive impairmant from alcohol, there is a more subtle effect of upregulated antioxidant activity. Namely, tobacco smoking doubles the levels of the vital detox enzyme catalase (and several others, including glutathione and SOD), which, among its numerous protective roles includes neutralizing of alcohols (as well as of cyanide, formaldehyde, toxic metals...). Hence anyone drinking alcohol will instinctively perceive tobacco smoke as a quite effective antidote to alcohol (and many other intoxicating or damaging substances/exposures) at multiple levels and on different time scales.

so the alcohol has an effect on my movement and is hard to assess fully. Cigarettes, i will say, do help with depression and some ADHD symptoms if you continue to smoke them for a couple of weeks daily. I also highly recommend against this.

The common supermarket cigarettes are not made from tobacco leaf at all but from "tobacco" sheets (colored and flavored mix of tobacco scraps with wood pulp and other cheap fillers). They are thus to real tobacco leaf what processed junk foods are to organic, whole foods. Further, cigarette filters, in addition to shedding non-biodegradable fibers (which eventually have to be enclosed into mucous liquid and coughed out), shift the finely honed (over seven millennia of lifelong use by 2-3 billions of test subjects) balance of medicinal components in the natural tobacco smoke toward less beneficial ratios. Note that nicotine patches not only lack the MAO B, immune/antioxidant and endocrine effects of the real tobacco smoke, but such delivery mechanism misses the dynamical and instant feedback elements of traditional smoking, essential for optimal dosing, rhythms and benefits of exercise effect.



For those wishing to experiment with the real 'gift of gods', the presently best approach is to get organic, additive free rolling tobacco, such as American Spirit (more info here; see also other 'natural' brands), and make their own non-filtered cigarettes (smoked via cigarette holders) or smoke it in a pipe. Using the current injection machines making a pack takes less than 5 minutes after only few days of practice:




Tuned up injector from SYO site:

I hate to burst your bubble nightlite, BUT smoking that crap is just as bad IMO than buying a pack of Newports at the gas station.

You are smoking GMO modified tobacco that is anything but natural.

If you want to truly smoke natural, you have to buy the organic tobacco such as American Spirit Organic Blend.

A lesson to be learned is to not let the unnatural term of "Natural" fool you. Don't feel bad though. A lot of people don't realize this.

Now go throw away all of those cancer sticks you've rolled and buy some organic tobacco and start over!


edit: I see you say to buy organic, but all I see within your pictures is the natural yet unorganic tobacco.

Thanks, Saphir!
I will defenetly try Pramiracetam, is it good for long term? Are you still on?
Any side effects?

Many “scientifical facts” are realty skams where the selection is not on random but is made in order to substantiate the hypothesis. Usury this is done by medical companies that is interest in making money by authorize the use of there harmful drugs. But what is the motive on this; way sub stain and spread the myth that tobacco is harmful and case lung cancer? Yeast because of its possible medical value thats simply to far-fetched.

Maybe its true that people likely to have lung cancer have a inclination to smoking. I do now that people witch schizophrenia do not get there illness from smoking weed, as have bin claimed, but on the contrary self medicate with out being aware of it. neither dos meat, eggs and saturated fat case hart attacks but people likely to have hart attacks seams to like this food probably because it contains carnosin and other components supporting cardiovascular health.

However it seams as if people in arias where chewing Betel nut is common are several of times more likely to develop cancer in there mouth, this kind of cancer are wary uncommon. I have hard to believe that some other component other than the nicotine case this and it seams even more unlikely that all people chewing Betel nut would have some other common denominator that really cases the cancer. Any way if the nicotine in the Betel nut really is a protective factor the ting casing cancer would be of serious nature.

nightlight what’s you’re opinion of the Datura plants as medical plants? Yeast as tobacco they have bin one of the most important medical plants in history (some times combined witch tobacco). And Yeast as nicotine they have a set of receptors related to acetylcholine but wear nicotine is stimulating Atropine (or is it scopolamine?) has calming effect on the nerve system. Maybe thaws two plants holed the optimal solution for many illnesses?

Edited by narcissistic, 29 April 2007 - 06:45 PM.

Thanks, Saphir!
I will defenetly try Pramiracetam, is it good for long term? Are you still on?
Any side effects?

Pramiracetam is not for long-term. There are some who won't touch the stuff because of something about the NO production in the brain. I take piracetam and aniracetam right now, and I won't touch pramiracetam.

Luv2, what you mean by that "no production in the brain"?
2. Why it is not for long term?

Edited by reflexus, 29 April 2007 - 07:37 PM.

Here is an interesting video from TED. You can skip ahead to the part about "Gillian Lynne". Sir Ken Robinson makes an opinion known about ADHD.

Ken Robinson talks about ADHD

I think god gives some ability to (ADHD-talented) and in exchange he takes something away. From my experience, I was always hyperactive and successful in sport activities. Anyway. I think it is some kind of dysfunction which causes performance degradation on brain activities. I need to find some long term solution for me, otherwise i am gonna say bye bye to my carer forever, but i wont give up to fight.

Here is an interesting video from TED. You can skip ahead to the part about "Gillian Lynne". Sir Ken Robinson makes an opinion known about ADHD.

Ken Robinson talks about ADHD

Certainly going to bookmark that site.

There are so many different theories to ADHD its not even funny. All you can do is look back at your life over and over again and see things that trigger the symptoms and ask your relatives how they perceived you in your younger years. Getting a family history is also quite beneficial but, unless you have thousands of dollars to throw around on genetic testing and brain scans, many of us will never know.

+ Stay away from things that over activate glutamate
+ Keep brain inflammation down and protected through using multiple antioxidants
+ Maybe get some choline and piracetam going on for an edge
+ Exercise everyday
+ Meditate everyday
+ Dabble with biofeedback
+ Try online brain training programs
+ Eat fruits, veggies, and nuts and stay away from allergens such as: whey, dairy, gluten, and maybe soy
+ Don't smoke too many American Spirits
+ Fish Oil, Ginkgo, Grape Seed -blah blah blah

Do some of these things and you may just end up "ok".

re: ADHD and even bipolar, "atypical depression," non "atypical depression," chemical or non chemical habit abuse etc

Sometimes the damage to the neurons is so individual that convenient labels are placed on a person's condition.

Luckily, the brain is able to extend dendrites around damaged areas ie "rewire"; "before and after" pet scan confirmations are soon to be published in a small group of people that functioned in a way that rewired their brain in the same way that the brain was designed to wire in the first place ie when we were very very young.

Unfortunately, people ( whose motive may likely be to discredit certain kinds of therapy ) will use an improper set of patients ( with wrong attitudes ) and adjust the numbers statistically to discredit the truth. It will be easy to do. In fact, this allowance was also designed.

Bottom line: We were designed to have trials. We were designed to operate our attitude in certain ways.

[ And I, personally, take responsibility for a majority of the damage that I self inflicted due to my operating way outside those parameters for too long a time. ]

However, I am equally confident that when I do operate in the way I was designed and daily practice this in myself and with other like minded, rewiring does occur, and the "medications" ( ie monoamine regulators combined with other neuroendocrine hormone interactions ) can be reduced to a minimum in many with mental/physical health variances.

Otherwise, operating outside designed parameters, others will unfortunately have to experience the result of designed natural consequences and take more medicine over a longer time with more side effects. Just as, in general, one can't buck the laws of thermodynamics; one can't buck the laws of design.

Although I personally am convinced the laws of design are actually present for my own good.

I agree with much in the end summary of the last post:


+ Keep body ( including brain ) inflammation down and protected through using antioxidants and certain omega 3 replacements

+ Exercise everyday ... and no I'm not necessarily talking about all that aerobic stuff

+ Meditate everyday... and only on specific kind of meditation ...
thereby keeping the brain active and in agreement with both soul and spirit

+ Diet is important but not to the point of being "your GOD"

Low doses of all three of the meds in the original post are reasonably safe but people are so so individual ( proven in fine detail of professional articles for instance in Adderal ) that most mental health treatment is not cut and dry at all.

I've had schools tell me my 8 year old son should be seen by professionals to get meds for behavior that is most likely ADHD.

I've been trying lots of structure and physical activity. He eats very healthy compared to most kids

I read with interest people's experiences with the ADHD meds... especially for their children. I can see how it could help him with his lack of impulse control and propensity to be overly emotional for a kid of his age, even though he is very 'book' smart.

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sounds like me when I was 8, except for “very book smart”, to day I show no signs of dopamine shortage. I’m not even sure that that’s the case apparently sedative medication work as well.