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Thoughts on Dr. Daniel Amen?


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#1 pinkyandbrain

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Posted 16 February 2007 - 03:13 AM


Hey all, I was curious to hear anyone's thoughts / experiences with Dr. Daniel Amen and his work? I read his "Making a Good Brain Great" a year or so ago and just reviewed it recently.

My thoughts:

-Overall seemed like a good book for the general, non-technical audience

-As with most books on the brain intended for a general audience (I've been reading through a lot of them at Borders), a lot of the information is pretty obvious--exercise, seek intellectual stimulation, etc.

-His take on supplements is unabashedly overenthusiastic (this definitely stood out, because this time I read the book directly after reading a number of Cochrane Reviews and other literature reviews on nootropic supplements, and it was interesting comparing the two...Amen's book coincidentally only quoted the positive studies, many of which have been called into question in literature reviews due to their small sample sizes, outdated methodology, or other problems)

-In contrast, his take on drugs seemed negatively biased. For example, he comes out strongly against nicotine. I'm a little biased because I followed Yesavage's group when I was at Stanford, and he conducted a number of studies showing nicotine improving cognitive enhancement significantly (far more than the "nootropic supplements"...not that I'm against supplements, but it seemed that nicotine's effects are more definitive and more significant). In Amen's defense, I believe he's making an argument more from the perspective of long-term health rather than short-term enhancement.

-He is *obsessed* with SPECT (anyone who read the book can probably vouch for that...he goes on and on about it, as if it's the greatest diagnostic tool ever...)

This is the basic "stack" that he seemed to recommend for everyone:

Acetyl-L-carnitine (500-1500mg a day
Alpha lipoic acid (100-200mg a day)
Fish oil (1-2g a day)
Vitamin B complex (400-800mcg folate, 50mg B6, 500-1000mg B12)
Vitamin C (250mg twice a day)
Vitamin E (100 I.U. twice a day

I'm curious to hear what you guys think about Amen's stack, and his book / expertise / etc.

#2 luv2increase

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Posted 16 February 2007 - 05:23 AM

Well, I am not too fond of that stack. It is very "weak". If he recommends a stack like that, I would not have faith in him. Where are the nootropics at??????? ALCAR is the closest thing to one in there.

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#3 addam

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Posted 16 February 2007 - 11:11 PM

surprised he doesn't say anything about cerebral metabolism increasers like Vinproctine. Why wouldn't he? Out of all nootropics related to the research he does, that should be one to look into.

#4 Shepard

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Posted 17 February 2007 - 01:24 AM

I like Amen more than Braverman, but I'm not crazy about him, either.

#5 pinkyandbrain

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Posted 17 February 2007 - 06:10 PM

Well, I am not too fond of that stack.  It is very "weak".  If he recommends a stack like that, I would not have faith in him.  Where are the nootropics at???????  ALCAR is the closest thing to one in there.


True...in his defense, he also spoke positively about a number of other herbs. This is the basic stack that he recommends "for everyone," so it's understandable that it would be somewhat more conservative, and geared more towards long-term health / prevention rather than specifically cognitive enhancement.

Other herbs he recommends under specific circumstances:
Coenzyme Q10 (30 - 200 mg / day) - "Use if at risk for heart disease or Parkinson's"
Phosphatidylserine (100-300mg / day) - "Use if at risk for dementia or memory problems"
L-Thenanine (50-200mg / day)
Vinpocetine (10 mg / day) - Use if you have high homocysteine levels or at risk for heart disease or stroke"

#6 pinkyandbrain

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Posted 17 February 2007 - 06:17 PM

I like Amen more than Braverman, but I'm not crazy about him, either.


Yeah, Braverman's definitely suffers from making incredibly sweeping generalizations and not referencing his assertions at all...there's a difference between writing for a non-technical audience, and writing a children's book on neuroscience =).

Having said that, I finally had some downtime and decided to pick up Braverman's book, "The Edge Effect." I'm about 3/4 of the way through, and even though the sweeping generalizations are questionable, they do provide a kind of interesting framework to look at things (the "dopamine nature," "acetylcholine nature," etc.).

Shepard, whose work do you prefer? I was considering looking through Perlmutter's book too...I doubt Yesavage, Turner, or any of the people doing the "real" research are going to be writing popular books anytime soon =).

#7 Shepard

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Posted 18 February 2007 - 02:45 AM

Shepard, whose work do you prefer? I was considering looking through Perlmutter's book too...


I generally prefer textbooks over popular science books when it comes to neuroscience. The ones that I do like generally don't involve supplements.

#8 pinkyandbrain

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Posted 18 February 2007 - 07:03 AM

Shepard, whose work do you prefer? I was considering looking through Perlmutter's book too...


I generally prefer textbooks over popular science books when it comes to neuroscience. The ones that I do like generally don't involve supplements.


Which textbooks / popular science books would you recommend, then? It seems like most textbooks wouldn't give much discussion to nootrops / cognitive enhancers...within academic works, I've had more luck reading reviews by Yesavage, Turner, etc., but I'd definitely be willing to check out a relevant textbook if you have any recommendations...

#9 jackinbox

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Posted 18 February 2007 - 02:51 PM

From his website:
"Everything starts and ends in your Brain-Soul connection."

Nothing good for credibility.

#10 Shepard

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Posted 19 February 2007 - 02:18 PM

Which textbooks / popular science books would you recommend, then? It seems like most textbooks wouldn't give much discussion to nootrops / cognitive enhancers


They don't discuss nootropics to any significant extent. I think a lot of people would be better off starting with a basic text first. Some texts worth finding on eBay:

Neuroscience
Principles of Neural Science

Most of the pop-sci books on the mind I like are more evolutionary psychology than anything else.

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#11 beej

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Posted 26 February 2007 - 08:18 AM

I absolutely consumed his book, making it my bible for ove a year. By the time I was finished with it it was totally worn out and dog eared so that with the fact I am a registered nurse, but moreso the fact I am absolutely obsessed with cutting edge neuroscience and pharmacology makes me feel I am qualified to comment:



He has done alot of interesting work with spect scans but it is only a research tool. Their value as a diagnostic tool is extreemly limited as after a sample of a few thousands individuals you get a fair idea how an individual with particular symtems scan is going to present and besides, If an individual presents with x symptoms but the scan shows y, what are you going to do? Withhold treatment? Treatment for mental illness is essentially symptomatic. These scans give you no idea on the best medication to use, and no idea what the activation of the brain looks like under various real world conditions. In short, they are a money generating tool for Amen clinic. It is their hook.

The book is also riddled with ommesions that make you ask why 2 patients presenting in essentially the same way got different treatments. It fails to explain the action of many of these drug treatments or brush's over them very quickly.

He also fails to make any effort to de-pathologise ADHD ie: show it as not an illness, but a deviation (to varying degrees) from normal brain funtion (neurodeversity http://www.today.ucl..._disabled.html) he doesn't explain that ADHD is on the autism spectrum of illness's and that while it can be disabling, it can also be a blessing.

He doesn't talk about harm minimization and the growing body of evidence that dexamphetamine even at theraputic doses can be neurotoxic, or stratagies to minimize that neurotoxicity like DXM and Magnesium or any partial nmda partial agonist.

From my memory he doesn't talk about all the great historical figures like edison and einstien who were almost certainly ADHD.
From the stand point of children especially he doesn't ask the question "If a group of adults were watchinga play in a thetre and a third of them got up and left because they couldn't follow it. Whold that be a reflection on the audience or the actors? Yet schools expect the sam
e thing from kids but in this case, if they cant concentrate on what is borning and disinteresting they are medicated and chemically and phisically forced to stay

He also barely touchs on comorbidities, (which themselves are just meaningless labels arbatrarily applied by psychietrists) instead attempting to make even more meaningless diagnosies to label and individual with things like Type 6 AHDD, "ring of fire" (Hello, bipolar, masnia/hypomania)
An example that springs to mind of the nemerous factual innacturacys, like the difference between bipolar and "ring of fire" is that bipolars are cyclic and ring of fire adders "tend" to be consistant in their levels of arousal...."tend"

Well, Bipolars can and often do have cycles lasting months or even years and when they cycle down it may only be to a hypomanic state rather than calm and collected. Also, they don't spend equal ammounts of time in each cycle, they may only become "sedate" for a few weeks before switching back to mania. There is also what is called a mixed state where patients can be depressed and energised at the same time. Medicene has known about this for a century or so but he has repackaged it like its a new discovery.

That said, he has done alot of valluable research and offers alot of usefull suggestions, it is definetly worth a read as the style is easy to digest. But Don't take it too seriously. The book, "hunter farmer therey was far better for me as an explanation for the existance of adhd personally




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