19 replies to this topic

[Spiral Architect]

I've been using Modafinil for a while, but very rarely. I'm very happy with the results, but I'm reluctant to increase the frequency.

I'd like to hear about the experience people who use it more often have with it. Also, is there any research about the short and long term effects of frequent use?

(To clarify: In the ~year I've had it, I've used it around 1.5 times a month on average, once a week at the most)

Edited by Kane, 08 December 2007 - 07:36 PM.

[enzyme]

I've been using Modafinil for a while, but very rarely. I'm very happy with the results, but I'm reluctant to increase the frequency.

I'd like to hear about the experience people who use it more often have with it. Also, is there any research about the short and long term effects of frequent use?

(To clarify: In the ~year I've had it, I've used it around 1.5 times a month on average, once a week at the most)

I have been using Modafinil 100mg BD + bupropion 150mg MR BD for 10/52. (LundtL. Treatment in patients with seasonal affective disorder/winter depression: An open-label pilot study. J Affect Disord. 2004;81(2):173–8) ... I still get the urge to fall asleep in the middle of the day & have not really felt much cognitive enhancement. However, prior to that I was starting to hibernate as SAD kicked in. I have had it for years & it gets worse each year as I get older. I could hardly speak this time as it became dark.

Bupropion/Modafinil combo works rapidly - it is as we say in the UK, "the Badgers Nadgers!" I use it in conjunction with nocturnal melatonin as this mood improves mood in SAD (Lewy AJ et al 1998a; Rohr UD et al 2002). I use a light box *a lot*, do loads of exercise, take omega 3, + other supps/antioxidants etc but the thing that really got me going again was modafinil/bupropion. SSRI's don't work well & have too many crap side-effects in my experience. Bupropion is licensed in the USA for SAD, but not in the UK where I live. I now feel great. I have had no side-effects. I am productive & energised & a lot easier to live with.

The only problems I have now are with the medical establishment in the UK. We have the cheapest/limited use prescription formularies that are 10 years behind the rest of the world. It is virtually impossible to prescribe modafanil/bupropion/melatonin without inducing harrassment from an NHS prescribing advisor(enforcer). Don't believe Michael M. - Socialist/Beveridge health systems like ours are stalinist dystopias to work in & I would not recommend them to patients either. As such, my prescription runs out in 2/52 ...

Apologies for getting on my soapbox.

Patrick

[jubai]

I treat Modafinil like moderate coffee - good, as long as you don't overdo it.

Keeping it low-dose (50-100mg), 5* a week is good for cognition with no subjective bad effects, as long as you don't skimp on the sleep.

[Spiral Architect]

I treat Modafinil like moderate coffee - good, as long as you don't overdo it.

Keeping it low-dose (50-100mg), 5* a week is good for cognition with no subjective bad effects, as long as you don't skimp on the sleep.

Seriously? 5 times a week? Are you sure that's healthy?

[enzyme]

I've been using Modafinil for a while, but very rarely. I'm very happy with the results, but I'm reluctant to increase the frequency.

I'd like to hear about the experience people who use it more often have with it. Also, is there any research about the short and long term effects of frequent use?

(To clarify: In the ~year I've had it, I've used it around 1.5 times a month on average, once a week at the most)

The usual starting dose for licensed use is 100mg twice daily, which is used long term by people with cataplexy without problems. It does not cause dependence. Side-effects are rare & mild (headache & nausea mainly). There are a few reports of some nasty skin reactions but this is rare. Were you concerned about anything in particular?

[Spiral Architect]

I've been using Modafinil for a while, but very rarely. I'm very happy with the results, but I'm reluctant to increase the frequency.

I'd like to hear about the experience people who use it more often have with it. Also, is there any research about the short and long term effects of frequent use?

(To clarify: In the ~year I've had it, I've used it around 1.5 times a month on average, once a week at the most)

The usual starting dose for licensed use is 100mg twice daily, which is used long term by people with cataplexy without problems. It does not cause dependence. Side-effects are rare & mild (headache & nausea mainly). There are a few reports of some nasty skin reactions but this is rare. Were you concerned about anything in particular?

I am concerned about negative long term effects that might be caused due to the unusually prolonged, high activity level of my brain. Desensitizations/tolerance and other long lasting neuronal/synaptic changes. When you change the activity level of the brain for a long period, you usually get some sort of short or even long term change. Since modafinil affects many parts of the brain in a very obvious, excitatory manner, I have some concerns about using it frequently. What I'd like to see is a study with cataleptics (or any other dosed subjects) which tests their memory & learning abilities before and after, for example.

I suffer from nausea (probably the only thing with nausea as a side effect that actually affects me) about once in 4-5 times. Is there anything to do to alleviate this problem?

[enzyme]

I've been using Modafinil for a while, but very rarely. I'm very happy with the results, but I'm reluctant to increase the frequency.

I'd like to hear about the experience people who use it more often have with it. Also, is there any research about the short and long term effects of frequent use?

(To clarify: In the ~year I've had it, I've used it around 1.5 times a month on average, once a week at the most)

The usual starting dose for licensed use is 100mg twice daily, which is used long term by people with cataplexy without problems. It does not cause dependence. Side-effects are rare & mild (headache & nausea mainly). There are a few reports of some nasty skin reactions but this is rare. Were you concerned about anything in particular?

I am concerned about negative long term effects that might be caused due to the unusually prolonged, high activity level of my brain. Desensitizations/tolerance and other long lasting neuronal/synaptic changes. When you change the activity level of the brain for a long period, you usually get some sort of short or even long term change. Since modafinil affects many parts of the brain in a very obvious, excitatory manner, I have some concerns about using it frequently. What I'd like to see is a study with cataleptics (or any other dosed subjects) which tests their memory & learning abilities before and after, for example.

I suffer from nausea (probably the only thing with nausea as a side effect that actually affects me) about once in 4-5 times. Is there anything to do to alleviate this problem?

Good point - remains to be seen if it messes with your brain (e users take note).

I suppose if you took modafinil regularly so you could stay awake for days at a time while trying not to be killed in combat then brain damage is possible - the bullets are the real problem though.

Likewise, using it to allow "raving" & "dance" etc for 48hrs at a stretch might be harmful if done regularly. However, I suspect propronents of such activities must already be brain damaged to enjoy that sort of "music" in the first place ... such acoustic vandalism would be more dangerous than modafinil in my opinion.

[Spiral Architect]

Good point - remains to be seen if it messes with your brain (e users take note).

I suppose if you took modafinil regularly so you could stay awake for days at a time while trying not to be killed in combat then brain damage is possible - the bullets are the real problem though.

Likewise, using it to allow "raving" & "dance" etc for 48hrs at a stretch might be harmful if done regularly. However, I suspect propronents of such activities must already be brain damaged to enjoy that sort of "music" in the first place ... such acoustic vandalism would be more dangerous than modafinil in my opinion.

Nah, I only take it in the morning after a good night's sleep. My concerns still apply, I think...
Doesn't anybody know? :/


P.S. Don't knock it till you try it.

[deekz]

Good point - remains to be seen if it messes with your brain (e users take note).

I suppose if you took modafinil regularly so you could stay awake for days at a time while trying not to be killed in combat then brain damage is possible - the bullets are the real problem though.

Likewise, using it to allow "raving" & "dance" etc for 48hrs at a stretch might be harmful if done regularly. However, I suspect propronents of such activities must already be brain damaged to enjoy that sort of "music" in the first place ... such acoustic vandalism would be more dangerous than modafinil in my opinion.

Ok,

So what I'm getting out of this sentence is that you need to be brain damaged in order to like this type of music.. am i correct? Let me ask you, what do you listen to and why would you come off with such a "mightier than thou" attitude towards a type of music you may not like.

[ikaros]

I've been using Modafinil for a while, but very rarely. I'm very happy with the results, but I'm reluctant to increase the frequency.

I'd like to hear about the experience people who use it more often have with it. Also, is there any research about the short and long term effects of frequent use?

(To clarify: In the ~year I've had it, I've used it around 1.5 times a month on average, once a week at the most)

The usual starting dose for licensed use is 100mg twice daily, which is used long term by people with cataplexy without problems. It does not cause dependence. Side-effects are rare & mild (headache & nausea mainly). There are a few reports of some nasty skin reactions but this is rare. Were you concerned about anything in particular?

I am concerned about negative long term effects that might be caused due to the unusually prolonged, high activity level of my brain. Desensitizations/tolerance and other long lasting neuronal/synaptic changes. When you change the activity level of the brain for a long period, you usually get some sort of short or even long term change. Since modafinil affects many parts of the brain in a very obvious, excitatory manner, I have some concerns about using it frequently. What I'd like to see is a study with cataleptics (or any other dosed subjects) which tests their memory & learning abilities before and after, for example.

I suffer from nausea (probably the only thing with nausea as a side effect that actually affects me) about once in 4-5 times. Is there anything to do to alleviate this problem?

I've been using Modafinil for a while, but very rarely. I'm very happy with the results, but I'm reluctant to increase the frequency.

I'd like to hear about the experience people who use it more often have with it. Also, is there any research about the short and long term effects of frequent use?

(To clarify: In the ~year I've had it, I've used it around 1.5 times a month on average, once a week at the most)

The usual starting dose for licensed use is 100mg twice daily, which is used long term by people with cataplexy without problems. It does not cause dependence. Side-effects are rare & mild (headache & nausea mainly). There are a few reports of some nasty skin reactions but this is rare. Were you concerned about anything in particular?

I am concerned about negative long term effects that might be caused due to the unusually prolonged, high activity level of my brain. Desensitizations/tolerance and other long lasting neuronal/synaptic changes. When you change the activity level of the brain for a long period, you usually get some sort of short or even long term change. Since modafinil affects many parts of the brain in a very obvious, excitatory manner, I have some concerns about using it frequently. What I'd like to see is a study with cataleptics (or any other dosed subjects) which tests their memory & learning abilities before and after, for example.

I suffer from nausea (probably the only thing with nausea as a side effect that actually affects me) about once in 4-5 times. Is there anything to do to alleviate this problem?

I've been using it since april 2007 daily. Last month I stopped for a week and did not notice anything abnormal. Modafinil's safe because it lacks direct reinforcing effect on the mood, like amphetamines have. I don't although consider it as a nootropic, i.e. I haven't noticed that it improves my memory. It's purely a vigilance promoting drug (with minor side-effects if taken too much or substituting sleep with it).

[enzyme]

Good point - remains to be seen if it messes with your brain (e users take note).

I suppose if you took modafinil regularly so you could stay awake for days at a time while trying not to be killed in combat then brain damage is possible - the bullets are the real problem though.

Likewise, using it to allow "raving" & "dance" etc for 48hrs at a stretch might be harmful if done regularly. However, I suspect propronents of such activities must already be brain damaged to enjoy that sort of "music" in the first place ... such acoustic vandalism would be more dangerous than modafinil in my opinion.

Ok,

So what I'm getting out of this sentence is that you need to be brain damaged in order to like this type of music.. am i correct? Let me ask you, what do you listen to and why would you come off with such a "mightier than thou" attitude towards a type of music you may not like.

OK! The music comment was a wind-up! Not serious. Flippant. Inappropriate. Fatuousness is possibly a modafinil side-effect. Do you take it?

However, Kanes concerns, are quite rational and I share them ... but there is an abscence of evidence of harm, so far.

It probably then boils down to how risk-averse you are? IDK, what do you think?

[enzyme]

Good point - remains to be seen if it messes with your brain (e users take note).

I suppose if you took modafinil regularly so you could stay awake for days at a time while trying not to be killed in combat then brain damage is possible - the bullets are the real problem though.

Likewise, using it to allow "raving" & "dance" etc for 48hrs at a stretch might be harmful if done regularly. However, I suspect propronents of such activities must already be brain damaged to enjoy that sort of "music" in the first place ... such acoustic vandalism would be more dangerous than modafinil in my opinion.

Nah, I only take it in the morning after a good night's sleep. My concerns still apply, I think...
Doesn't anybody know? :/


P.S. Don't knock it till you try it.

Knocking! Nah mate.

Modafinil - tried. It's v good. House/Dance have not tried as I cannot stay awake that late - even with modafinil. Combat - would prefer to avoid.

I'll watch out for reports of adverse effects & report them if I come across them. It would be a good idea if we all do. Like pharmacological meerkats ...

[Spiral Architect]

Good point - remains to be seen if it messes with your brain (e users take note).

I suppose if you took modafinil regularly so you could stay awake for days at a time while trying not to be killed in combat then brain damage is possible - the bullets are the real problem though.

Likewise, using it to allow "raving" & "dance" etc for 48hrs at a stretch might be harmful if done regularly. However, I suspect propronents of such activities must already be brain damaged to enjoy that sort of "music" in the first place ... such acoustic vandalism would be more dangerous than modafinil in my opinion.

Nah, I only take it in the morning after a good night's sleep. My concerns still apply, I think...
Doesn't anybody know? :/


P.S. Don't knock it till you try it.

Knocking! Nah mate.

Modafinil - tried. It's v good. House/Dance have not tried as I cannot stay awake that late - even with modafinil. Combat - would prefer to avoid.

I'll watch out for reports of adverse effects & report them if I come across them. It would be a good idea if we all do. Like pharmacological meerkats ...

Hah, I like the analogy. Will do.

[J_Garrett]

Well, I have been using Modafinil almost daily for almost 3 years. Before you call up your local university to arrange for a case study, I would like to point out that (I think) I am quite ok, and have progressively reduced the dose from about 300mg daily to around 50mg daily. I have noticed all the same effects at high dose that have been mentioned here, as well as poor episodic memory, which seems to be common with Modafinil and many of the Ampakine drug group according to what I have read. I have suffered badly from an Anxiety disorder from a very early age, and this has been the only compound I have ever tried which has had much of an impact on it. I now feel as though I am part of society again, rather than some painfully shy person that just sat on the periphery. I would find it hard to go back to not taking it, although I do give it breaks from time to time.

I would warn against taking this as any sort of recommendation for Modafinil, but it has, in my case, worked reasonably well. It is certainly not however without side effects, and I have found that around the 50mg mark strikes the right balance between effects and side effects to allow me to get the best use out of it. More than that, then the anxiety is gone but so is a good deal of the thought process - its hard to come up with anything spontaneous and everything seems to be somewhat cloudy.

I would be most interested in any long term studies on this drug and would be more than happy to participate in one if there was one being conducted.

[dopamine]

I've taken 400 mg per day (in one morning dose) for extended periods (3+ months) with no specific ill effects that come to mind. The stimulating effects do wane quite dramatically over time, until the point where I didn't feel anything at all that was directly attributable to the drug. I don't think modafinil quite fits into the simplistic psychostimulant category in which one must heed the common wisdom that chronic dosage should be low, while acute dosage should be high. Not a recommendation, but rather a personal observation.

[Spiral Architect]

I've taken 400 mg per day (in one morning dose) for extended periods (3+ months) with no specific ill effects that come to mind. The stimulating effects do wane quite dramatically over time, until the point where I didn't feel anything at all that was directly attributable to the drug. I don't think modafinil quite fits into the simplistic psychostimulant category in which one must heed the common wisdom that chronic dosage should be low, while acute dosage should be high. Not a recommendation, but rather a personal observation.

What was the purpose of this high dose?
What effects did stay with you after you stopped "feeling" it?

[dopamine]

What was the purpose of this high dose?
What effects did stay with you after you stopped "feeling" it?

The 400 mg dose was prescribed to counteract the negative side effects of lexapro (escitalopram), which probably affected the way I responded to the drug. After I stopped "feeling" it, there was a transient sense of wakefulness throughout the day that was not present beforehand. After I took the dose there was no "up" or "down" but rather a general therapeutic effect (less yawning, no need to take naps, etc) that I suspect is related to achieving steady-state levels of the parent compound in the body.

[J_Garrett]

What was the purpose of this high dose?
What effects did stay with you after you stopped "feeling" it?

The 400 mg dose was prescribed to counteract the negative side effects of lexapro (escitalopram), which probably affected the way I responded to the drug. After I stopped "feeling" it, there was a transient sense of wakefulness throughout the day that was not present beforehand. After I took the dose there was no "up" or "down" but rather a general therapeutic effect (less yawning, no need to take naps, etc) that I suspect is related to achieving steady-state levels of the parent compound in the body.

Were you able to think very clearly on that sort of a dose? I found that anything above 200mg scrambled things up and was more a hinderance than a help.

[psy333che]

I have been taking provigil now for about 3 1/2 years daily I am prescribed 400mg but I only take 50mg to 100mg most days
I break it up in 50mg doses and use more when I am traveling and need to be more awake then normal When I am feeling okay
I have a sleep disturbance where my alpha waves are always active
taking 100mg or more makes me too jittery so 50 mg at a time every 4 to 6 hours as needed works best for me

I've been using Modafinil for a while, but very rarely. I'm very happy with the results, but I'm reluctant to increase the frequency.

I'd like to hear about the experience people who use it more often have with it. Also, is there any research about the short and long term effects of frequent use?

(To clarify: In the ~year I've had it, I've used it around 1.5 times a month on average, once a week at the most)

[happy]

25-50mg/day 2-3x/week