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#1 Phreak

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Posted 27 April 2009 - 03:09 PM


I've heard lots of raving about how good Magnesium is for... almost everything! It seems to go with every stack, but particularly has prominent effects for depression and anxiety...

In fact, on this forum I have seen posted several times how Magnesium has completely eradicated some pretty severe chronic depression!

I have to say; I'm impressed, yet skeptical (although not very). I am going to buy some Magnesium tomorrow to see if it'll help with my mild depression and intense anxiety.

Would This kind of thing be what I'm after? (Magnesium 250mg)

I'm posting this now without having done the faintest sliver of research, so please don't tell me to go and research it myself because I'll be doing that immediately after this post. I just thought there is no extra harm in getting subjective reports from people here who take it and had positive results. I'll get onto the researching right now. But I have just 5 very straightforward, easily-answered basic questions:

1) Any particular type of Magnesium supplement better than the other (i.e. Citrate over...whatever else there is? Magnesium + Zinc etc..)
2) What kind of dose for maximum effects?
3) How many times daily?
4) What other benefits does it have?
5) Is there anything it shouldn't be mixed with?


I know this comes across as incredibly lazy, but I'm just trying to mix-and-match personal experience with objective information on the net.
Any other feedback welcomed :p

#2 biknut

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Posted 27 April 2009 - 03:30 PM

I take Magnesium for heart health. I'm not that particular about what kind. I've noticed that any more than 250 iu a day has undesirable effects when I go to the bathroom.

Interestingly my doctor says I don't need it because you get all you need from diet. I've read that there's not much Magnesium left in our soil though.

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#3 rwac

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Posted 27 April 2009 - 03:35 PM

Would This kind of thing be what I'm after? (Magnesium 250mg)
1) Any particular type of Magnesium supplement better than the other (i.e. Citrate over...whatever else there is? Magnesium + Zinc etc..)

Anything except Magnesium Oxide(That's probably the form in the link), pretty much. Citrate is ok.
Malate, Taurate (also provides taurine, which helps with relaxation & sleep), Orotate (expensive), glycinate etc are good.

2) What kind of dose for maximum effects?

say 200-400 mg/day
Also, drop your calcium intake to below your Magnesium intake.

3) How many times daily?

Depends on whether it makes you feel sleepy.


4) What other benefits does it have?

It should reduce inflammation, cramps, bruxism etc
Too much will make you sleepy and sluggish
If you take too much at one time, you will have GI issues. This issue occurs less if the Mag is more absorbable.


5) Is there anything it shouldn't be mixed with?

Not that I know of.

Edited by rwac, 27 April 2009 - 03:36 PM.


#4 rmac230

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Posted 27 April 2009 - 04:27 PM

What about epsom salt? Does that raise levels of magnesium?

#5 nameless

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Posted 27 April 2009 - 04:36 PM

I like Mag orotate or the Albion magnesiums (glycinate) myself. The one you posted a link to is oxide -- avoid.

#6 Phreak

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Posted 27 April 2009 - 05:11 PM

Would This kind of thing be what I'm after? (Magnesium 250mg)
1) Any particular type of Magnesium supplement better than the other (i.e. Citrate over...whatever else there is? Magnesium + Zinc etc..)

Anything except Magnesium Oxide(That's probably the form in the link), pretty much. Citrate is ok.
Malate, Taurate (also provides taurine, which helps with relaxation & sleep), Orotate (expensive), glycinate etc are good.

2) What kind of dose for maximum effects?

say 200-400 mg/day
Also, drop your calcium intake to below your Magnesium intake.

3) How many times daily?

Depends on whether it makes you feel sleepy.


4) What other benefits does it have?

It should reduce inflammation, cramps, bruxism etc
Too much will make you sleepy and sluggish
If you take too much at one time, you will have GI issues. This issue occurs less if the Mag is more absorbable.


5) Is there anything it shouldn't be mixed with?

Not that I know of.


Ah, thank you - I was just about to purchase that one!
It's a very easy-to-find compound but does anyone who uses it regularly have a UK source that they particularly like? I'm happy to buy Citrate which I can get from my local Holland & Barrett, but I'd prefer links to places where I can mag Mag. Ortate (I'm okay with spending a decent amount of money on a decent supplement), Glycinate, Taurate and Malate - UK based if possible.

I have chronic insomnia and almost nothing (bar sublingual Melatonin on top of my 3 prescription meds) seems to help me. I sleep very little, am exhausted in the mornings but almost never have EDS. I am prescribed Modafinil to use when I do experience it, but I mainly save this for Nootropic benefits. My point being: there is very little that makes me tired. I've have taken 200mg 5-HTP, 2g Valerian, 6mg Clonazepam and 5mg Diazepam during the day in the past [I hadn't slept for 2 days and I was starting to have frightening aural hallucinations; plus I have a high tolerance] and I still did not sleep until I took my 2.5mg Melatonin. Hence, I am not worried that large doses of Magnesium will make me sleepy. I would be happy to take larger doses and get maximum benefits...

You also mentioned to "...drop [my] Calcium intake to below my Magnesium intake". I wouldn't really know how to go about doing this...

I don't take any Calcium supplements and I would be able to check on my multivitamin how much calcium is in a single pill, but how am I supposed to regulate this when it comes to food? I mean, both minerals are in almost all foodstuffs - should I alter my diet? I can avoid milk, cheese, chocolate etc.. but will I have to cut out bread and pasta and so on as well; Surely if I'm taking a high dose of Magnesium everyday then my Magnesium levels should naturally exceed my Calcium intake...?


Hmm, y'know I said I'd do a lot of research after I posted this thread..? Well, I did. I did a Wikipedia browse, a few forum browses and a general Google search with "magnesium", "depression", "stress" and "anxiety" as keywords but got nothing at all definitive. In fact, the only thing close to a wholly positive response regarding Magnesium --> Depression was here on this forum...
Does anyone have any links to articles or clinical studies that prove (or even shine a glimmer of hope) on Magnesium as a beneficial supplement for depression?

*************************************************************************

I like Mag orotate or the Albion magnesiums (glycinate) myself. The one you posted a link to is oxide -- avoid.


Crap.

Just after I made this thread I texted my friend asking if he could grab me some Magnesium on his way home from work and he just came in and gave me 100 x 250mg tabs of Magnesium OXIDE from Holland & Barrett :( Is this beneficial at all or should I just keep it for use in conjunction with an NSAID (i.e. Ibuprofen) next time I have a headache?

Edited by Phreak, 27 April 2009 - 05:15 PM.


#7 rwac

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Posted 27 April 2009 - 05:20 PM

What about epsom salt? Does that raise levels of magnesium?


Magnesium sulfate is used as a laxative, so it's probably not very absorbable.

#8 f00bar

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Posted 27 April 2009 - 05:32 PM

What about epsom salt? Does that raise levels of magnesium?


Magnesium sulfate is used as a laxative, so it's probably not very absorbable.

It's strongly hygroscopic. As I understand it the laxative effect is caused by MgSO4 "attaching" lots of water in the colon. So the Mg+ probably doesn't stay in your body as rmac says.

Anyways, what's about the carbonate? Seems to be very common as well in grocery store products. At least that's what's in the bottle in my kitchen. :p It would be cool not having to order minerals and vitamins from special stores but just pick it up when shopping for groceries. :p

#9 rwac

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Posted 27 April 2009 - 05:52 PM

Ah, thank you - I was just about to purchase that one!
It's a very easy-to-find compound but does anyone who uses it regularly have a UK source that they particularly like? I'm happy to buy Citrate which I can get from my local Holland & Barrett, but I'd prefer links to places where I can mag Mag. Ortate (I'm okay with spending a decent amount of money on a decent supplement), Glycinate, Taurate and Malate - UK based if possible.

I have chronic insomnia and almost nothing (bar sublingual Melatonin on top of my 3 prescription meds) seems to help me. I sleep very little, am exhausted in the mornings but almost never have EDS. I am prescribed Modafinil to use when I do experience it, but I mainly save this for Nootropic benefits. My point being: there is very little that makes me tired. I've have taken 200mg 5-HTP, 2g Valerian, 6mg Clonazepam and 5mg Diazepam during the day in the past [I hadn't slept for 2 days and I was starting to have frightening aural hallucinations; plus I have a high tolerance] and I still did not sleep until I took my 2.5mg Melatonin. Hence, I am not worried that large doses of Magnesium will make me sleepy. I would be happy to take larger doses and get maximum benefits...

You also mentioned to "...drop [my] Calcium intake to below my Magnesium intake". I wouldn't really know how to go about doing this...

I don't take any Calcium supplements and I would be able to check on my multivitamin how much calcium is in a single pill, but how am I supposed to regulate this when it comes to food? I mean, both minerals are in almost all foodstuffs - should I alter my diet? I can avoid milk, cheese, chocolate etc.. but will I have to cut out bread and pasta and so on as well; Surely if I'm taking a high dose of Magnesium everyday then my Magnesium levels should naturally exceed my Calcium intake...?


Hmm, y'know I said I'd do a lot of research after I posted this thread..? Well, I did. I did a Wikipedia browse, a few forum browses and a general Google search with "magnesium", "depression", "stress" and "anxiety" as keywords but got nothing at all definitive. In fact, the only thing close to a wholly positive response regarding Magnesium --> Depression was here on this forum...
Does anyone have any links to articles or clinical studies that prove (or even shine a glimmer of hope) on Magnesium as a beneficial supplement for depression?

*************************************************************************


I was only talking about calcium supplements (why do so many people take lots of calcium ...).
Don't worry about food.

Magnesium Taurate at night *may* help you with sleep.

Efficacy and safety of oral magnesium supplementation in the treatment of depression in the elderly with type 2 diabetes: a randomized, equivalent trial.

http://www.ncbi.nlm....pubmed/19271419

Antidepressant activity of zinc and magnesium in view of the current hypotheses of antidepressant action.
http://www.ncbi.nlm....pubmed/19066406

#10 notlupus

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Posted 27 April 2009 - 07:26 PM

Anyways, what's about the carbonate? Seems to be very common as well in grocery store products. At least that's what's in the bottle in my kitchen. :p It would be cool not having to order minerals and vitamins from special stores but just pick it up when shopping for groceries. :p

Only local place I've been able to find magnesium that's not oxide is the vitamin shop. I've looked at every bottle at CVS too, since I have a bunch of gift cards there.

#11 f00bar

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Posted 27 April 2009 - 07:56 PM

Thanks for the answer notlupus. Nothing like vitamin shops around here. But there's a BB shop nearby. Gotta check what supplements they stock otherwise i have to go to the pharmacy.

And sorry for asking such a question. Carbonate seems to be crap as well, not hard to find out.
I guess I'll get citrate. Does it make sense to get it as a bulk powder? Quantities aren't too small to dose from powder. But does it oxidise quickly?

#12 Imagination

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Posted 27 April 2009 - 08:08 PM

I find it makes me quite tired which is the only draw back I find, so tend not to take it in the day and take it before bed, or if i'm just unwiding at home after work.

I take it as I get occasional heart palpitations and it seems to work pretty well for that and also for sleep when I can't shut down. I normally take it as and when rather than every day.

Don't know if it does anything for depression, but it certainly works for anxiety, i sometimes get anxiety after drinking so take magnesium and it calms me down.

Bog standard stuff is fine, I get mine from asda for dirt cheap and its good stuff. Or take zma at night instead.

#13 Phreak

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Posted 27 April 2009 - 08:43 PM

I took 500mg an hour ago and feel fine. Obviously I'm at home so I can't gauge any change in anxiety levels, but I don't feel tired (which is a plus 'cause it's a high dose). I feel a bit relaxed and that's all. Gonna continue taking this stuff.

ALSO

I thiiiiink I've found the stuff I'm after (and I know a shop nearby where I can get it from :p)

I hope this is it: Solgar Chelated Magnesium 400mg - click on 'Product Information' for the detailed info...

?????????????

It's not Magnesium Orotate but this stuff is meant to be good, right?
If so, it sounds perfect. One 400mg pill a day :p

[The way it's described is: "Magnesium (as amino acid chelate)". There's no mention of 'Glycinate' though...]

#14 tunt01

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Posted 27 April 2009 - 08:46 PM

Magnesium Taurate at night *may* help you with sleep.

Efficacy and safety of oral magnesium supplementation in the treatment of depression in the elderly with type 2 diabetes: a randomized, equivalent trial.

http://www.ncbi.nlm....pubmed/19271419

Antidepressant activity of zinc and magnesium in view of the current hypotheses of antidepressant action.
http://www.ncbi.nlm....pubmed/19066406


i think funk or someone on this site takes that ZMA (zinc+magnesium) endurance combination that was created by BALCO when they go to sleep at night. i should look into it...

#15 rwac

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Posted 27 April 2009 - 09:23 PM

Magnesium Taurate at night *may* help you with sleep.

Efficacy and safety of oral magnesium supplementation in the treatment of depression in the elderly with type 2 diabetes: a randomized, equivalent trial.

http://www.ncbi.nlm....pubmed/19271419

Antidepressant activity of zinc and magnesium in view of the current hypotheses of antidepressant action.
http://www.ncbi.nlm....pubmed/19066406


i think funk or someone on this site takes that ZMA (zinc+magnesium) endurance combination that was created by BALCO when they go to sleep at night. i should look into it...


I tried it and found I didn't like the aspartate part of it.
It made me feel jittery. I doubt Funk uses ZMA.

I hope this is it: Solgar Chelated Magnesium 400mg - click on 'Product Information' for the detailed info...

Looks good. Just be aware that you'll have to take 4 pills to get 400 mg.
So it's good (smaller pills) and bad (more of them to take).

Edited by rwac, 27 April 2009 - 09:24 PM.


#16 nameless

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Posted 27 April 2009 - 09:33 PM

I thiiiiink I've found the stuff I'm after (and I know a shop nearby where I can get it from :p)

I hope this is it: Solgar Chelated Magnesium 400mg - click on 'Product Information' for the detailed info...

?????????????

It's not Magnesium Orotate but this stuff is meant to be good, right?
If so, it sounds perfect. One 400mg pill a day :p

[The way it's described is: "Magnesium (as amino acid chelate)". There's no mention of 'Glycinate' though...]

Yeah, that one is fine. But it's 100mg/per tablet, not 400mg each. Recommended dose is 4 per day according to their label.

Other Albions:
Carlson makes a good albion mag, but it's a pretty big pill, if I remember correctly.
http://www.iherb.com...lets/10928?at=0
Bluebonnet makes one in vegicapsule form.
http://www.iherb.com...caps/14198?at=0

Some people like the mag taurates too, although it bothered my stomach when I tried it. And for orotates, I like AOR's CardioMag, but it's quite expensive as far as magnesiums go.

In regard to magnesium citrate, it wouldn't be my first choice. It does absorb better than oxides, but there could possibly be some aluminum absorption issues with citrates --
Calcium citrate markedly enhances aluminum absorption from aluminum hydroxide.
http://www.ncbi.nlm..../pubmed/2042654

Shopping at drugstores like CVS for supplements can be really tricky. Most of the brands are junk. Natrol probably would be my semi-acceptable drugstore choice for certain things, but not sure there are any others.

Edited by nameless, 27 April 2009 - 09:35 PM.


#17 ajnast4r

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Posted 27 April 2009 - 09:39 PM

Thought I would throw it in that 3 forms of magnesium completely eliminate my heart palpitations:

Albion glycinate
Biotron chelates
Aspartate

I would avoid magnesium salts like oxide and carbonate.... While they are better than nothing, you can usually find a citrate or chelate in any drug store or pharmacy.

Iherb has Albion glycinates from Carlson labs and blue bonnet for pretty cheap...

#18 tunt01

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Posted 27 April 2009 - 09:40 PM

when you say palpitations what exactly was your diagnosis/pathology?

just curious

#19 nameless

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Posted 27 April 2009 - 09:41 PM

Anyone besides Nature's Plus make Biotron chelates? I've never tried them, as they are somewhat difficult to find.

#20 psy333che

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Posted 28 April 2009 - 01:13 PM

I would like to add that it is also used for a long very time for neuropic pain experienced with diabetes. I use it to deal with the pain I experience with RA and Fibro
It does cause diarrhea in large doses but if you slowly build up to an amount and get your body use to larger amounts it does not happen anymore.. It really is important with a any supplement to begin with smaller amounts
I think sometimes there is a misunderstanding that there is no harm because it is natural,etc... I find it all the time being a horticultursit dealing with people feeling that using organic compounds makes them safe when that is not the case at all


I've heard lots of raving about how good Magnesium is for... almost everything! It seems to go with every stack, but particularly has prominent effects for depression and anxiety...

In fact, on this forum I have seen posted several times how Magnesium has completely eradicated some pretty severe chronic depression!

I have to say; I'm impressed, yet skeptical (although not very). I am going to buy some Magnesium tomorrow to see if it'll help with my mild depression and intense anxiety.

Would This kind of thing be what I'm after? (Magnesium 250mg)

I'm posting this now without having done the faintest sliver of research, so please don't tell me to go and research it myself because I'll be doing that immediately after this post. I just thought there is no extra harm in getting subjective reports from people here who take it and had positive results. I'll get onto the researching right now. But I have just 5 very straightforward, easily-answered basic questions:

1) Any particular type of Magnesium supplement better than the other (i.e. Citrate over...whatever else there is? Magnesium + Zinc etc..)
2) What kind of dose for maximum effects?
3) How many times daily?
4) What other benefits does it have?
5) Is there anything it shouldn't be mixed with?


I know this comes across as incredibly lazy, but I'm just trying to mix-and-match personal experience with objective information on the net.
Any other feedback welcomed :)



#21 Phreak

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Posted 28 April 2009 - 10:36 PM

......

I hope this is it: Solgar Chelated Magnesium 400mg - click on 'Product Information' for the detailed info...

Looks good. Just be aware that you'll have to take 4 pills to get 400 mg.
So it's good (smaller pills) and bad (more of them to take).


Well I'm glad I ended up buying this then: http://www.hollandan...ail.asp?pid=450

Chelated Magnesium 150mg (or, as they call it, "absorbable magnesium"). I think it's the same stuff. I hope it is. Plus it's cheap, available really near me and *fingers crossed* with help with anxiety and insomnia... At 150mg per pill it's actually quite a good deal. I mean, you probably wouldn't wanna take four because you be taking a lil bit too much (600mg; and it's more bioavailable so no need). Two would probably do the job. Possibly 3...? 2 in the morning with a completely empty stomach, and one a couple of hours between lunch and dinner...

Anyone here find Chelated Magnesium good for:
a) depression
b) anxiety
c) stress
d) insomnia

#22 bgwithadd

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Posted 29 April 2009 - 01:43 AM

get ionic fizz. It is a powder you add to water. It's by far the best magnesium supplement you can take, and it's 20 dollars for 2 month supply.

#23 nameless

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Posted 29 April 2009 - 02:10 AM

get ionic fizz. It is a powder you add to water. It's by far the best magnesium supplement you can take, and it's 20 dollars for 2 month supply.

What is ionic magnesium? Mag chloride? If so, there is no evidence that it's better than other forms.

#24 frederickson

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Posted 30 April 2009 - 05:54 AM

my mother is on a beta-blocker for heart arrythmia (atrial fibrillation)

would magnesium be helpful for her with this condition and in combination with this medicine? or could there be some interaction with the medication that is supposed to normalize heart rhythm?

#25 tunt01

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Posted 30 April 2009 - 11:03 AM

my mother is on a beta-blocker for heart arrythmia (atrial fibrillation)

would magnesium be helpful for her with this condition and in combination with this medicine? or could there be some interaction with the medication that is supposed to normalize heart rhythm?


i had a transient, mild afib recently. i've ordered magnesium orotate. based on this thread: http://www.imminst.o...showtopic=18215


notice the comments from Neogenic and the study cited later w/ 23 triathletes.

rgds,

pro

#26 bgwithadd

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Posted 01 May 2009 - 01:49 AM

get ionic fizz. It is a powder you add to water. It's by far the best magnesium supplement you can take, and it's 20 dollars for 2 month supply.


There's probably evidence out there, or at the least I know there's plenty of knowledge about how poorly most forms are absorbed. Once you take it, you won't need any evidence. It's the only sort of magnesium that won't cause any gastro upset at alla nd you can feel how well absorbed it is.

Edited by bgwithadd, 01 May 2009 - 01:50 AM.


#27 drtom

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Posted 01 May 2009 - 09:43 AM

Greetings All,

If you can find some magnesium-lactate; that is a readily bio-available source.

Mg-deficiency has been implicated in many illnesses. One of the more obscure is heart problems, such as mitral valve prolapse (MVP). One of the symptoms of MVP (among others) is palpitations. About 300mg of Mg-Lactate/day for 16 weeks has been shown to reduce symptoms of MVP.
Mg is thought to be implicated in MVP because it is used in collagen synthesis and the MV is high in collagen.
So, not enough Mg--->defective collagen synthesis--->MVP (and possibly other connective tissue disorders).
Mind you; being deficient in Mg doesn't need to mean you live in an area poor in Mg; more likely you are defective for a gene that codes for a protein needed to absorb dietary Mg. Or perhaps you excrete too much. many possible scenarios.

Cheers,

#28 desperate788

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Posted 02 May 2009 - 11:53 AM

Greetings All,

If you can find some magnesium-lactate; that is a readily bio-available source.

Mg-deficiency has been implicated in many illnesses. One of the more obscure is heart problems, such as mitral valve prolapse (MVP). One of the symptoms of MVP (among others) is palpitations. About 300mg of Mg-Lactate/day for 16 weeks has been shown to reduce symptoms of MVP.
Mg is thought to be implicated in MVP because it is used in collagen synthesis and the MV is high in collagen.
So, not enough Mg--->defective collagen synthesis--->MVP (and possibly other connective tissue disorders).
Mind you; being deficient in Mg doesn't need to mean you live in an area poor in Mg; more likely you are defective for a gene that codes for a protein needed to absorb dietary Mg. Or perhaps you excrete too much. many possible scenarios.

Cheers,


cheers!

is magnesium supplementation helpful for heart palpitations that are not caused by magnesim deficiency?

#29 Lufega

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Posted 02 May 2009 - 03:37 PM

my mother is on a beta-blocker for heart arrythmia (atrial fibrillation)

would magnesium be helpful for her with this condition and in combination with this medicine? or could there be some interaction with the medication that is supposed to normalize heart rhythm?


Yes it would me. Make sure you add taurine as well. Beta-blockers are dangerous down the line. Have her Doctor help her taper of them slowly, while incorporating more Mg. If you could, it would be interesting to TEST her magnesium levels before she starts to supplement. Serum, hair and maybe RBC levels would be fine.

http://george-eby-re...rrhythmias.html

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#30 Lufega

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Posted 02 May 2009 - 03:42 PM

I'm trying to figure out where the problem with magnesium is. I'm going to have a 24 hour magnesium urine excretion to figure out if the problem is renal. If this is normal, then it means there's a consumption going on of some sorts (infectious?) or some type of malapsorption. The latter can be determined with a stool analysis of magnesium post loading. Many researchers are working on this issue and have all hit a dead end. I had a random magnesium urine sample and it came back normal. However, it wasn't a 24 hour. Regarless, if Mg was wasting via the kidney, the random sample would have been high.

Intractable Magnesium deficiency

Magnesium is also a cofactor for hyaluronic acid.

I should also add, at 22 I was diagnosed with MVP with regurgitation. At 29 and after supplementing with magnesium for a couple of years, the MVP is gone, confirmed via ECO. A small amount of physiological regurgation remains though.

Edited by Lufega, 02 May 2009 - 03:53 PM.





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