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#1 Louise101

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Posted 01 May 2009 - 09:19 PM


I just can't take this anymore. Granted this is a bad day, but I know the drill. I've basically been depressed for years (I remember being "depressed" at 7!). Obviously (to me) this is a lack of/excess of something in my brain. There is no logical reason that I should be depressed. It appears to run in my family (on my father's side). I was on SSRIs for 8 years. I'm off them now because I'm sick to death of the side effects (I literally had to nap every day on those things). The birth of my child worsened my depression/anxiety dramatically. Now, 5 years later, I'm still depressed. ENOUGH! If anyone (Bueller? anyone??) can give me some suggestions I'd be so appreciative. I know you probably get a lot of these posts, so I am very thankful for your time.

Here is what I've used:

- Prozac, Zoloft, Celexa, Effexor....all moderately helpful for a while, but many side effects (gained over 70 lbs, very fatigued, flatlined)....eventually "poop out"
- Provigil/Modafinil (seemed to cause some anxiety and later did nothing at all)
- Lamictal prescribed by a psychiatrist...didn't seem to do anything but I ended up getting itchy so that was stopped

- inositol (took large amounts for 6 months, don't see much difference)
- high doses of a high-quality multi vitamin (expensive, don't see much difference)
- higher doses of separate vitamins (ex: B6, zinc, folic acid) -- zilch
- Fish oil (high EPA) - 2 grams daily for months, zero effects other than maybe made me a little dizzy
- St John's Wort - this doesn't seem to help but maybe I'm not staying on it long enough
- Passion Flower - nothing
- so many amino acid supplements - absolutely nothing (other than L-Tyrosine which revs me up a bit)
- 5-HTP (nothing)
- very expensive SAM-E supplement for 3 months (absolutely nothing)
- Ginko (nothing)
- I rented a lightbox during the winter (again, nothing)

I can't figure out anything that will help me. I've never found a doctor who can help (or who even seems to really care much). My psychiatrist suggested I MAY be bipolar II (but he admits he doesn't really know--he says it isn't a clear-cut case) and was starting to suggest Lithium. No way. As much as I hate depression I can't stand getting fat again (I finally lost the weight off the SSRIs) or any of the other stupid side effects.

My diet is great (leafy greens, lots of raw fruits/veggies, lean protein, some whole grains). Coffee does make me feel very good if used sparingly (too much and I get anxious). I exercise a little (not much I'll admit...so hard to be motivated when you feel like a slug drowning in cement). I sleep well.

My family is really suffering. My depression appears cyclic and maybe tied to hormones (I actually am more depressed at the beginning of my monthly cycle, which is total opposite to PMS...the doctors I've spoken to say they've never heard of that before...figures). I've had a hormone panel and told I was low in progesterone, but supplementing didn't do anything at all. I tend to just feel dead and want to hide away, or I'm really, really irritable. I'm afraid I'm creating bad childhood memories for my kid. Also I have spent SO much money on supplements, etc and I can't keep doing that. None of them work anyway. My thyroid tests comes back normal but I feel it must be a little off as my skin/hair seem to have become really dry/frizzy. But that's just another needle in the haystack. I'm so sick of feeling that it would be much much easier to just jump off the pier. Everyone around me seems to effortlessly enjoy life and I can't get there. It's been years and I'm tired.

#2 Lufega

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Posted 01 May 2009 - 09:55 PM

How's your magnesium intake?

Magnesium and depression

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#3 Louise101

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Posted 01 May 2009 - 10:02 PM

How's your magnesium intake?

Magnesium and depression


Thanks. I should mention I take Natural Calm magnesium powder every night. I find it helps me fall asleep and the raspberry flavor is yummy. :-D

#4 VespeneGas

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Posted 01 May 2009 - 10:11 PM

Just off the top of my head:

Deprenyl (they make a patch for depression)

Wellbutrin - if it doesn't make you really anxious it might be really helpful, certainly wouldn't make you gain a bunch of weight

Low dose lithium (like 5-30mg elemental) per day seems to help keep away the dark moods for me

I don't think I've ever read about EPA knocking out depression, DHA seems to be the happy sauce:

Health benefits of docosahexaenoic acid (DHA)
Horrocks LA, Yeo YK. Docosa Foods Ltd, 1275 Kinnear Road, Columbus, OH 43212-1155, USA,

Docosahexaenoic acid (DHA) is essential for the growth and functional development of the brain in infants. DHA is also required for maintenance of normal brain function in adults. The inclusion of plentiful DHA in the diet improves learning ability, whereas deficiencies of DHA are associated with deficits in learning. DHA is taken up by the brain in preference to other fatty acids. The turnover of DHA in the brain is very fast, more so than is generally realized. The visual acuity of healthy, full-term, formula-fed infants is increased when their formula includes DHA. During the last 50 years, many infants have been fed formula diets lacking DHA and other omega-3 fatty acids. DHA deficiencies are associated with foetal alcohol syndrome, attention deficit hyperactivity disorder, cystic fibrosis, phenylketonuria, unipolar depression, aggressive hostility, and adrenoleukodystrophy. Decreases in DHA in the brain are associated with cognitive decline during aging and with onset of sporadic Alzheimer disease. The leading cause of death in western nations is cardiovascular disease. Epidemiological studies have shown a strong correlation between fish consumption and reduction in sudden death from myocardial infarction. The reduction is approximately 50% with 200 mg day(-1)of DHA from fish. DHA is the active component in fish. Not only does fish oil reduce triglycerides in the blood and decrease thrombosis, but it also prevents cardiac arrhythmias. The association of DHA deficiency with depression is the reason for the robust positive correlation between depression and myocardial infarction. Patients with cardiovascular disease or Type II diabetes are often advised to adopt a low-fat diet with a high proportion of carbohydrate. A study with women shows that this type of diet increases plasma triglycerides and the severity of Type II diabetes and coronary heart disease. DHA is present in fatty fish (salmon, tuna, mackerel) and mother's milk. DHA is present at low levels in meat and eggs, but is not usually present in infant formulas. EPA, another long-chain n-3 fatty acid, is also present in fatty fish. The shorter chain n-3 fatty acid, alpha-linolenic acid, is not converted very well to DHA in man. These longchain n-3 fatty acids (also known as omega-3 fatty acids) are now becoming available in some foods, especially infant formula and eggs in Europe and Japan. Fish oil decreases the proliferation of tumour cells, whereas arachidonic acid, a longchain n-6 fatty acid, increases their proliferation. These opposite effects are also seen with inflammation, particularly with rheumatoid arthritis, and with asthma. DHA has a positive effect on diseases such as hypertension, arthritis, atherosclerosis, depression, adult-onset diabetes mellitus, myocardial infarction, thrombosis, and some cancers. Copyright 1999 Academic Press.

PMID: 10479465 [PubMed - indexed for MEDLINE



Low levels of docosahexaenoic acid identified in acute coronary syndrome patients with depression.
Parker GB, Heruc GA, Hilton TM, Olley A, Brotchie H, Hadzi-Pavlovic D, Friend C, Walsh WF, Stocker R. School of Psychiatry, University of New South Wales, Prince of Wales Hospital, Randwick, NSW 2031, Australia. g.parker@unsw.edu

As deficiencies in n-3 PUFAs have been linked separately to depression and to cardiovascular disease, they could act as a higher order variable contributing to the established link between depression and cardiovascular disease. We therefore examine the relationship between depression and omega-3 polyunsaturated fatty acids (n-3 PUFA), including total n-3 PUFA, docosahexaenoic acid (DHA) and eicosapentaenoic acid (EPA), in patients with acute coronary syndrome (ACS). Plasma phospholipid levels of n-3 PUFA were measured in 100 patients hospitalized with ACS. Current major depressive episode was assessed by the Composite International Diagnostic Interview (CIDI). Depression severity was assessed by the 18-item Depression in the Medically Ill (DMI-18) measure. Patients clinically diagnosed with current depression had significantly lower mean total n-3 PUFA and DHA levels. Higher DMI-18 depression severity scores were significantly associated with lower DHA levels, with similar but non-significant trends observed for EPA and total n-3 PUFA levels. The finding that low DHA levels were associated with depression variables in ACS patients may explain links demonstrated between cardiovascular health and depression, and may have prophylactic and treatment implications.

PMID: 16499974 [PubMed - indexed for MEDLINE


1: Psychiatr Clin North Am. 2000 Dec;23(4):785-94.Links
Docosahexanoic acid and omega-3 fatty acids in depression.
Mischoulon D, Fava M.
Depression Clinical and Research Program, Department of Psychiatry, Massachusetts General Hospital and Harvard Medical School, Boston, Massachusetts, USA.

Geographic areas where consumption of DHA is high are associated with decreased rates of depression. DHA deficiency states, such as alcoholism and the postpartum period, also are linked with depression. Individuals with major depression have marked depletions in omega-3 FAs (especially DHA) in erythrocyte phospholipids compared with controls. These data suggest that DHA may be associated with depression, and the limited data available on supplementation with DHA or other omega-3 FAs seem to support the hypothesis that DHA may have psychotropic effects. Overall, the use of EFAs is promising, particularly in view of the many illnesses potentially treatable with these substances; however, larger, carefully designed studies are needed to establish whether DHA is an effective and safe antidepressant, mood stabilizer, or antipsychotic. A few preliminary trials of DHA are in progress, but no studies comparing DHA against placebo or against an established antidepressant have been carried out. Studies to address this issue are being developed at the Massachusetts General Hospital. Studies likely will require escalating doses of DHA, eventually reaching high levels so as to ensure that patients will avoid a potentially ineffective subclinical dose. Careful monitoring of dietary intake among subjects also will necessary because a high intake of omega-3-rich foods may confound results. Finally, large-scale, placebo-controlled, double-blind trials comparing the efficacy and safety of DHA against standard antidepressants are required before psychiatrists can recommend DHA therapy as effective and safe for the treatment of depression and other mood disorders. Given the popularity of self-medication by patients who already are taking marketed antidepressants, studies examining the use of DHA as an augmentor to standard antidepressants may answer whether DHA can occupy a niche as an augmenting agent for patients who have made a partial response or have not responded to conventional antidepressants. Considering that natural medications generally seem best for treating mild to moderate illness, the role of DHA as a therapy for minor and subsyndromal depression also should be considered. It is hoped that studies of these types will help to clarify some of the knowledge gaps outlined in this article.

PMID: 11147247 [PubMed - indexed for MEDLINE


1: Eur Neuropsychopharmacol. 2008 Sep;18(9):639-45. Epub 2008 Jun 6.
A double-blind dose-finding pilot study of docosahexaenoic acid (DHA) for major depressive disorder.
Mischoulon D, Best-Popescu C, Laposata M, Merens W, Murakami JL, Wu SL, Papakostas GI, Dording CM, Sonawalla SB, Nierenberg AA, Alpert JE, Fava M.
Depression Clinical and Research Program, Massachusetts General Hospital and Harvard Medical School, Boston, MA 02114, United States. dmischoulon@partners.org

We examined the antidepressant efficacy and dose-response pattern of the n-3 docosahexaenoic acid (DHA). Thirty-five depressed adult outpatients (46% women; mean age 42+/-14 years) with a 17-item Hamilton-Depression Scale (HAM-D-17) score of >or=18 were randomized into one of three double-blind dosing arms for 12 weeks. Group A (n=14): 1 g/day of oral DHA; Group B (n=11): 2 g/day; and Group C (n=10): 4 g/day. We measured HAM-D-17 scores, plasma DHA, eicosapentaenoic acid (EPA), and n-6/n-3 ratio. Completer response rates (>or=50% decrease in HAM-D-17 score) were 83% for Group A, 40% for Group B, and 0% for Group C; Groups A and B had significant decreases in HAM-D-17 scores (p<0.05). For completers and intent-to-treat subjects, plasma DHA increased significantly (p<0.05), EPA had little change (p>0.05), and n-6/n-3 decreased significantly (p<0.05). DHA may be effective for depression at lower doses.

PMID: 18539007 [PubMed - in process]



Also, exercise really helps a lot of people against depression. If coffee or modafinil or whatever can get you on a bike or a track or lifting some weights, go for it!

Good luck, I hope you feel better soon!

#5 RoadToAwe

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Posted 01 May 2009 - 10:36 PM

Dr. Malcolm McLeod while working on one of his patients accidentally discovered that Chromium Picolinate was very effective in a subset of hard to treat depressive patients(specifically people with Atypical Depression).
You can read the experiences of some people who responded to Chromium Picolinate here.

http://www.chromiumc.../blog/index.asp

His idea was later tested in a small pilot trial.

A double-blind, placebo-controlled, exploratory trial of chromium picolinate in atypical depression: effect on carbohydrate craving.
http://www.ncbi.nlm....pubmed/16184071

Try 200-400 mcg of a good brand Chromium Picolinate and see if this works for you.

#6 fatboy

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Posted 01 May 2009 - 10:54 PM

- Fish oil (high EPA) - 2 grams daily for months, zero effects other than maybe made me a little dizzy ...


I didn't feel any relief from my decades long bout of depression with fish oil until I was up to 12g/day. But if you feel dizzy on 2g that may not be an option for you.

My depression appears cyclic and maybe tied to hormones ...


Quite possibly. Mine was due to low testosterone. 1 month after beginning HRT, voila no more depression. Black dog is still sleeping quietly in its cage 2 years later. But I'm a 210lb 46yo hypogonadal man, it's unlikely that's your problem ... then again, it might be worth a try, I know a number of women who take very low-dose testosterone as part of their overall HRT protocol.

Good luck!

Edited by fatboy, 01 May 2009 - 11:16 PM.


#7 lynx

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Posted 02 May 2009 - 12:49 AM

EMSAM is a good suggestion.

Also, how about deplin with whichever one of the above anti-depressants worked the best?

Or a psychostimulant, like Vyvanse or Concerta?

#8 4eva

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Posted 02 May 2009 - 02:19 AM

How is your dream recall. Little or no dream recall can be an indication of a B6 problem. It can help to supplement B6 until dream recall is restored to get a sense if you're taking enough.
B6 effects hormones too.

How do you handle stress. You said you wanted to be left alone. If stress is a problem you might do a search for pyroluria. This causes a person to lose B6 and zinc in their urine. You would not have supplemented enough B6 and zinc to correct symptoms of pyroluria. You need high doses, too high to take on your own (with medical supervision).

Pyroluria makes it hard to deal with stress. They become loners in later life to avoid stress.

Problems when your period starts might be about excess copper. When estrogen goes up (start of period) copper goes up. Copper toxicity can cause lots of symptoms most of them are the same as estrogen dominance and/or low thyroid.

#9 ajnast4r

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Posted 02 May 2009 - 05:30 AM

find a good, progressive doctor... the type who would be interested in reading the health & nutrition section on imminst, but actually went to med school. i think this more than most things will be the key to you figuring out what is actually wrong.

things worth trying:

get a hormone panel done when youre feeling good, and one when youre having a depressive episode... have you tried birth control?

get tested for heavy metal poisoning

get tested for lyme...a few times. search and read what FunkOdyssey had to say about lyme.

get a monospot done and tested for epstein-barr virus

get tested for celiac disease

Edited by ajnast4r, 02 May 2009 - 05:38 AM.


#10 Louise101

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Posted 02 May 2009 - 01:08 PM

Thanks. My dream recall is good. But I do have a lot of irritability. I'm taking Chromium Elemental, not sure if that's the same as Picolinate. But I used to take high (higher than on label) doses of Ortho-Core...I'm thinking it would be in there. Thanks for the info re: DHA. I have taken DHA too, but I switched to EPA because I thought that was the one I needed (EPA). Yeah, I doubt I could get all the way to 12 grams, but from what I've read it didn't seem to be necessary to go that high. Believe it or not, Lithium Orotate is not available here in Canada. It is even removed from the Canadian Ortho formula. And as for the other Lithium, I'd have to get that from a psychiatrist and I doubt he'd prescribe a super-low dose for me. I have no idea how to find a progressive doctor (do they really exisit??). I've been to many and they seem distracted and busy and definitely not willing to I don't even know how it comes....can it be scored? I know I can make an appt with a naturopath and they will be very progressive and order lots of tests, but they are soo expensive (ex: 1 hormone panel is almost $300), plus blood tests, etc etc. They discovered a nodule on my thyroid 6 months ago and they want to just monitor it with ultrasounds to see if it is getting bigger. My thyroid blood test was "normal" (although I don't know what she tested...but you'd think she'd test it all considering I have a nodule, right?!). I do have symptoms that look like they alternate between hypo and hyper thyroid. For example, for many months my hair has been crazy-frizzy and my skin is so dry. But the doctor doesn't seem interested in those symptoms. She just says the blood test looks fine.

As you can see, I'm just so confused. It takes a lot of work and research to figure this out and it is hard when you're depressed. :|



find a good, progressive doctor... the type who would be interested in reading the health & nutrition section on imminst, but actually went to med school. i think this more than most things will be the key to you figuring out what is actually wrong.

things worth trying:

get a hormone panel done when youre feeling good, and one when youre having a depressive episode... have you tried birth control?

get tested for heavy metal poisoning

get tested for lyme...a few times. search and read what FunkOdyssey had to say about lyme.

get a monospot done and tested for epstein-barr virus

get tested for celiac disease



#11 alexd

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Posted 02 May 2009 - 01:57 PM

Thanks. My dream recall is good. But I do have a lot of irritability. I'm taking Chromium Elemental, not sure if that's the same as Picolinate. But I used to take high (higher than on label) doses of Ortho-Core...I'm thinking it would be in there. Thanks for the info re: DHA. I have taken DHA too, but I switched to EPA because I thought that was the one I needed (EPA). Yeah, I doubt I could get all the way to 12 grams, but from what I've read it didn't seem to be necessary to go that high. Believe it or not, Lithium Orotate is not available here in Canada. It is even removed from the Canadian Ortho formula. And as for the other Lithium, I'd have to get that from a psychiatrist and I doubt he'd prescribe a super-low dose for me. I have no idea how to find a progressive doctor (do they really exisit??). I've been to many and they seem distracted and busy and definitely not willing to I don't even know how it comes....can it be scored? I know I can make an appt with a naturopath and they will be very progressive and order lots of tests, but they are soo expensive (ex: 1 hormone panel is almost $300), plus blood tests, etc etc. They discovered a nodule on my thyroid 6 months ago and they want to just monitor it with ultrasounds to see if it is getting bigger. My thyroid blood test was "normal" (although I don't know what she tested...but you'd think she'd test it all considering I have a nodule, right?!). I do have symptoms that look like they alternate between hypo and hyper thyroid. For example, for many months my hair has been crazy-frizzy and my skin is so dry. But the doctor doesn't seem interested in those symptoms. She just says the blood test looks fine.

As you can see, I'm just so confused. It takes a lot of work and research to figure this out and it is hard when you're depressed. :|



find a good, progressive doctor... the type who would be interested in reading the health & nutrition section on imminst, but actually went to med school. i think this more than most things will be the key to you figuring out what is actually wrong.

things worth trying:

get a hormone panel done when youre feeling good, and one when youre having a depressive episode... have you tried birth control?

get tested for heavy metal poisoning

get tested for lyme...a few times. search and read what FunkOdyssey had to say about lyme.

get a monospot done and tested for epstein-barr virus

get tested for celiac disease



Okay I went for decades before finding out what works for me. First off, what works for me may not work for you.

I concour with the suggestion for wellbutrin. After years of ssris I tried wellbutrin which worked a lot better. Now here is a clincher with any anti depressent you might try taking DEPLIN. Google it, there is a website. Iwas the first patient my Dr tried it on and it had a profound effect. In some people their ability to process folic acid is hampered. This is l methylfolate which goes striaght through the blood brain barrier.Without enough of the stuff in the brain neuro transmitters are hindered. Get some samples. I was able to drasitcly reduce the amount of psycho active drugs when taking this. Now the dr has found it works on other patients too. A pharmacist told me they are seeing a bit of this being prescribed. This is not an antidepressent it is an adjunt that makes them work better in people who have had limited responses.

You can try l-tyrosine which increases dopamine. this is usufull but only if you take it on an empty stomach, otherwise you will digest it into something else and it won't work.

Although I have not tried it NAC which is available from vitamin companies online has been tested to work in many people who suffer from depression as part of being bi polar.

Do not watch CNN or Fox news that stuff is alarming and depressing no matter what your brain chemistry.

Also look into cognitive therapy. It deals with the nature of our thoughts and is effective and rapid. Hard to go through years of depression without picking up some inappropriate baggage on the way. Good luck! Look me up here and you can get the whole regime that I do. The suggestion on exercise and such is also very good and appropriate for most people.

#12 Louise101

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Posted 02 May 2009 - 03:44 PM

Thanks Alex. Yes, I agree about CNN. I did take Wellbutrin for a while (oops forgot about that). It didn't help with depression that I could see, but it really revved up the libido. Then I think I started getting irritable from it. Too much dopamine maybe.

I have a question, not sure if anyone can answer....has anyone heard of iboga/ibogaine? I've heard a lot of things about it really helping with depression. There is a place in Vancouver that offers treatments (for drug addicts) but it would end up costing me about $5,000.

#13 StrangeAeons

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Posted 02 May 2009 - 03:58 PM

I've looked at ibogaine before, but it's some truly powerful stuff. Even if it were being offered for free and there was a clinic right across the street, I would keep it as a last resort. All the info on it I've seen is about addiction, but there's definitely been a fair amount said about the therapeutic potential of psychedelics in a positive setting for depression.

#14 nameless

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Posted 02 May 2009 - 04:07 PM

I posted about thyroid testing in a regimen post recently, and seeing as you may not have been properly tested, I recommend getting your thyroid rechecked. Besides the nodule, what shape was the rest of your thyroid in via the ultrasound? Enlarged at all? Lumpy texture? And what is the size of the nodule?

Do you have your thyroid bloodwork results handy? If so, can you post the results here?

I suggest a full thyroid panel, including TSH, Free T3, Free T4, and thyroid antibodies. If your doctor just checked TSH, your thyroid could be off and they'd never know it. Symptoms that flip-flop between hypo and hyper could very well be due to Hashimoto's.

Edited by nameless, 02 May 2009 - 04:09 PM.


#15 4eva

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Posted 02 May 2009 - 06:43 PM

A biotin deficiency might explain the frizzy hair and dry skin. I'm not sure what's in the ortho-core that you took high doses of. But that might be a possibility of causing an imbalance.

High doses of pantothenic acid would interfere with biotin absorption.

Antibiotics would effect biotin too, if you've took any in the recent past.

Biotin causes uncombable hair. Its more like kinky hair than frizzy hair.

Edited by 4eva, 02 May 2009 - 06:51 PM.


#16 tham

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Posted 02 May 2009 - 07:02 PM

It's possible you are histadelic.

http://www.uncommonf...p...asc&start=0

http://forum.lowcarb...ead.php?t=64775

http://www.healthrec...ler_coaster.htm

http://www.dr-bob.or...sgs/871016.html

http://www.diagnose-...nd/C447056.html

http://abchomeopathy...orum2.php/2825/

http://www.healthboa...r...6667&page=3

#17 Louise101

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Posted 02 May 2009 - 07:08 PM

You guys are awesome, thanks so much.

I don't have any idea about my thyroid....they didn't tell me anything other than there is a small nodule. Anyway, thanks for all the suggestions/links. If I ever do figure it out, I'll let you know what it was. :-D

#18 ajnast4r

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Posted 02 May 2009 - 07:26 PM

but there's definitely been a fair amount said about the therapeutic potential of psychedelics in a positive setting for depression.


i remember reading an article in discovery magazine, where the authors lifelong depression was cured after a single dose of ayahuascha

#19 lynx

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Posted 02 May 2009 - 08:09 PM

Ketamine Trial

Ketamine instantaneously reverses depression.

The effect lasts about a week and costs much less than $5000.

And it is safer, cleaner, more well studied than either ibogaine or ayahuasca.

Edited by lynx, 02 May 2009 - 08:13 PM.


#20 bgwithadd

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Posted 03 May 2009 - 12:18 AM

st john's wort - It's not super strong, but it is a big help, especially if you take larger doses like 2-3g.
deprenyl - If your PEA level is low, pleasure becomes impossible. Daily deprenyl or deprenyl + PEA is very effective for depression that does not respond well to other meds
MAOI-A - kind of like taking deprenyl + Prozac.
lithium orotate - I take 6 of these pills every day. Works well for depression and generally makes me more tolerant of other people.
exercise - increases all your brain neurotransmitters, helps especially for people that deprenyl and MAOI-A s help.
wellbutrin - helps a lot with energy and promotes weight loss, so it could help in combination with SSRIs if it doesn't work enough on its own.

My guess is that your problem is low PEA. This is what causes general 'treatment resistant depression'. You can up serotonin til the cows come home but it won't fix things. You need to take MAOI of some kind or deprenyl. Exercise will help, too. Good luck.

#21 bgwithadd

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Posted 03 May 2009 - 12:21 AM

BTW, the way ketamine works is that it is emulating what PEA does in your system. People with some forms of depression have about 1/10 the level as normal people. The deprenyl+DLPA route is also instant, but it's not going to have as much fear of neurotoxicity as glutamate agonist.

#22 k10

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Posted 03 May 2009 - 03:19 AM

Hmm you've tried a lot of things, but there's definitely a ton of uncharted territory that you can still explore.

I would encourage you to rule out physical causes of your depression completely such as hypothyroidism, hyperparathyroidism, etc.

Supplements that I believe should work that you haven't taken include:
* High dose magnesium
* Lithium Orotate, 15-30mg elemental (this is a safe over-the-counter supplement, without the side effects of prescription lithium)
* L-tyrosine, 1000mg 2-3 times a day
* Sam-E
* You can add a low dose of an antidepressants to Sam-E, as studies have shown this combination to be much more effective than either alone

How often do you exercise? Studies have shown exercise to be more effective than antidepressants in the long-run.

You may also consider using energy medicine, such as: accupuncture, homeopathy, reiki, etc.

Also it is important to be in counseling if you suffer from such depression your whole life.

Edited by k10, 03 May 2009 - 03:32 AM.


#23 k10

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Posted 03 May 2009 - 06:53 AM

Oh yeah I forgot to mention EFT, which stands for emotional freedom technique, here is an awesome video summing it up:
http://www.emofree.c...VIDEO_POPUP.ASP

You can download the manual for free:
http://www.emofree.c...adeftmanual.asp

#24 ajnast4r

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Posted 03 May 2009 - 07:02 AM

Oh yeah I forgot to mention EFT, which stands for emotional freedom technique, here is an awesome video summing it up:
http://www.emofree.c...VIDEO_POPUP.ASP

You can download the manual for free:
http://www.emofree.c...adeftmanual.asp


ive actually heard positive things about this too

Edited by ajnast4r, 03 May 2009 - 07:30 AM.


#25 lev-librium

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Posted 04 May 2009 - 01:24 AM

Hi Louise,

I take selegiline (Eldepryl) <or orhterwise known as Deprenyl - but Deprenyl is the name of the lab and not the medicine.>

I take it up to 10 mgs a day PRN. I can't say the selegiline will help with your depression but it has some very unique properties that works differently on certain individuals.

Chamomile tea is a great helper and other milder herbs. Tried the st. john wort and that crashed out.

Selegiline can be taken in small doses (at least for me) with some effectiveness.

It is just my own hypothesis that selegiline works in reverse for some strange reason. it has this strange property called (the prick factor). Therefore, if depression is your buddy or has become you friend in a psychological sense then selegiline (Eldepryl) may produce a strange effect of trying to divorce you from your depression buddy.

Speaking for my own self, it seems that the deprenyl also creates a condition where an individual may feel violated by some of the good feelings produced by the drug and instinctively try to resist them.(or fight them off).

More or less, if one is inherently used to feeling bad or depressed, Eldepryl may reveal to you that you may be hanging on to your depression for whatever reason. That may just be a pure side effect of the medicine.

I am not suggesting you take eldepryl, I am just sharing my own experiences with it. In certain situations with sleep paralysis it has worked wonders for me.

Edited by lev-librium, 04 May 2009 - 01:26 AM.


#26 Imminst = pro murder (omega)

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Posted 05 May 2009 - 05:38 AM

After reading the book "The Omega3 Connection" http://www.amazon.co...m/dp/0684871386 I have been taking 4 grams of the fatty acid EPA which is in fish oil. I get Mega EFA from Vitacost http://www.vitacost....mg-240-Softgels and take ten of the capsules per day. I've been doing this for more than two years now and whenever I stop for a couple of days, the depression comes back. It really works for me.

Recently got a bottle of a liquid lemon flavored version that doesn't upset my wife's stomach. She and the kids take it. Recent study found that kids who supplement with it test smarter taking it right up into their teens. I'd swear it has improved my memory and brain function tremendously but the best thing, after experiencing great depression off and on for practically decades, seems I finally got a handle on it. At times, I feel so high just on life now and I don't experience the downs anymore. When I've stopped taking it, upon resuming, I can notice a significant lifting of my mood within a day.

#27 Louise101

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Posted 06 May 2009 - 02:19 AM

After reading the book "The Omega3 Connection" http://www.amazon.co...m/dp/0684871386 I have been taking 4 grams of the fatty acid EPA which is in fish oil.


Hmm, I will try that. I went up to 2 grams before but didn't see anything. I'll try a higher dose. I have a couple of appointments booked for the end of May. This depression just wears me down so much. I feel like I've been wrestling with a monster for years or something. And it kind of scares me because at times I really feel suicidal. I feel so incredibly bleak and dead inside. Then....poof....for no reason at all it will be gone and I'll feel totally normal. Oh, to feel like that every day. It is ridiculous because I feel strongly that it is tied to have too much or not enough of something in the brain. You'd think that would be simple enough to figure out!!

#28 Imminst = pro murder (omega)

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Posted 06 May 2009 - 06:02 AM

Your symptoms sound a lot like what I was going through, I guess, in ernest for 15 years.

This is the one I got for my wife and kids. They experience some stomach upset with the capsules I get for myself but not with this Carlsen brand liquid version: http://www.vitacost....Finest-Fish-Oil . Looks like it would take 5 tsp. per day to get the amount seen to be effective in the trials Stohl reported. The taste is not bad at all and seems to be fine on an empty stomach or not. The NSI capsules I linked to earlier are cheaper.

If you get a chance to read the book, it is a real eye opener.

#29 ajnast4r

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Posted 06 May 2009 - 06:25 AM

. The NSI capsules I linked to earlier are cheaper.


dont buy NSI brand from vitacost... search for it, there have been quite a few complains of pretty serious contamination.

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#30 rwac

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Posted 06 May 2009 - 06:53 AM

Louise,

If high EPA fish oil doesn't work for you, perhaps you could try the high DHA version ?
Also, how much magnesium are you taking ?




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