71 replies to this topic

[Trias]

Hey guys,

I wonder if you'd recommend LEF's - "Life Extension Mix"
http://www.lef.org/n.../item00764.html

By the way - - appearently there are two versions for this product (this one's cheaper):
http://www.lef.org/n.../item00634.html

Still, I didn't understand why. What's the difference between them ?

I'm currently taking Pharmanex's Lifepak which seems to be quite ok, although LE-mix seems better.

Anyway, is this product recommended ?


Thanks
Daniel S.

[AORsupport]

I wonder if you'd recommend LEF's - "Life Extension Mix"
http://www.lef.org/n.../item00764.html

LEF makes very high-quality supplements. However, I'm afraid that I have to quibble with the formulation of many of them. The LEF mix contains many of the hazards common to multivitamins: enough retinol (preformed vitamin A) to roughly double your risk of fracture, unbalanced alpha-tocopherol levels high enough to drive out other E vitamers and increase your risk of all-cause mortality; high-dose niacinamide, which life extensionists should probably avoid due to the potential issue of niacinamide’s nullification of the potential anti-aging effects of sirtuins; hazardous (>20:1) zinc-to-copper ratio; putting green tea extract into the mix, even though green tea and its extracts inhibit absorption of various minerals; inclusion of a variety of ingredients (Such as sylimarin) with no proven safety or efficacy in normal, healthy humans; a dose of lycopene (3 mg) far below the 14-18 mg present in the diets of the high-quintile of the population, established by epidemiology for reduced risk of a variety of diseases; other, minor issues.

AOR has Essential Mix, a powdered multi that solves all of these problems; forthcoming basic and advanced encapsulated multis will also cover these issues. The advanced formulation, Ortho•Core, includes key phytochemicals at doses backed for health benefits in normal, healthy humans, along with detoxification enzyme substrates, and will be available in Canada shortly and in the USA about a month thereafter; watch the AOR website for news. The formulation has been finalized (apologies for the formatting: the forum software won't accept either spaces or manual tabs):

SUPPLEMENT FACTS:
Serving Sizes: 1 Capsule 9 Capsules %DRI
Phytonutrient Complex
Calcium D-Glucarate ………………………………….. 1.6 mg 15 mg *
Chlorophyllin Complex………………………………… 33 mg 300 mg *
Trans-resveratrol (Chirally Pure)………………………. 200 mcg 1.8 mg *
Indole-3-Carbinol (I3C)………………………………… 2 mg 20 mg *
Sulforaphane ………………………………………….. 789 mcg 7.1 mg *

Vitamins
Vitamin A Complex
Retinol (palmitate)……………………………….. 17 mcg 56 IU 150 mcg 500 IU 16.70%
Natural-Source Mixed Carotenoids:
Alpha-carotene……………………………… 178 mcg 148 IU 1.6 mg 1332 IU 44.4%
Beta-carotene………………………………. 666 mcg 1110 IU 6.0 mg 9990 IU 333%
Cryptoxanthin………………………………. 3 mcg 3 IU 30 mcg 25 IU 0.8%
Lutein………………………………………… 744 mcg 6.7 mg *
Lycopene……………………………………. 2 mg 18 mg *
Zeaxathin……………………………………. 61 mcg 545 mcg *

Vitamin B Complex
B1 (Thiamine) …………………………………... 1 mg 9 mg 750%
B2 (Riboflavin) ………………………………….. 278 mcg 2.5 mg 192%
B3 (Niacin (as 144 mg Inositol Hexanicotinate))… 13 mg 115 mg 718%
B5 (d-Ca Pantothenate)………………………….. 11 mg 100 mg 2000%
B6 (Pyridoxine)…………………………………… 3 mg 25 mg 1470%
B12 (Cyanocobalamin)…………………………… 2.6 mcg 24 mcg 1000%
Folic Acid…………………………………………. 89 mcg 800 mcg 400%
Biotin……………………………………………… 33 mcg 300 mcg 1000%
Pyrroloquinoline quinone (PQQ)………………… 3.3 mcg 30 mcg *
Choline (from Bitartrate 500 mg)………………… 22 mg 200 mg 36%
Inositol (from Inositol, Inositol Hexanicotinate)…… 11 mg 100 mg *

Vitamin C Complex
Vitamin C (Magnesium Ascorbate)………………. 13 mg 120 mg 133%
Mixed Citrus Bioflavonoids………………………. 11 mg 100 mg *
Quercetin………………………………………… 7 mg 65 mg *

Vitamin D3 (Cholecalciferol) ………………………….. 2.7 mcg 111 IU 25 mcg 1000 IU 167%

Vitamin E Complex ……………………………………. 11 mg 100 mg *
Tocopherols: 10 mg 90 mg
alpha-tocopherol …………………………… 1.3 mg 2 IU 12 mg 18 IU 80%
beta-tocopherol …………………………….. 0.9 mg 8 mg *
gamma-tocopherol………………………….. 6 mg 52 mg *
delta-tocopherol…………………………….. 1.9 mg 17 mg *
Tocotrienols: 1 mg 10 mg *
alpha-tocotrienol …………………………… 333 mcg 3 mg *
beta-tocotrienol …………………………….. 11 mg 0.1 mg *
gamma-tocotrienol …………………………. 667 mg 6 mg *
delta-tocotrienol…………………………….. 144 mg 1.3 mg *
Vitamin K2 (As Menatetrenone (MK-4))……………….. 56 mcg 500 mcg 416%

Minerals
Boron (Citrate)…………………………………………. 200 mcg 1.8 mg *
Calcium (Citrate-Malate, D-Glucarate)………………… 33 mg 300 mg 30%
Chromium (Picolinate)………………………………….. 11 mcg 100 mcg *
Copper (Citrate)………………………………………… 167 mg 1.5 mg 167%
Iodine (Potassium Iodide)……………………………… 17 mcg 150 mcg 100%
Lithium (Orotate)……………………………………….. 111 mcg 1000 mcg *
Magnesium (Citrate, Aspartate,
Oxide, Ascorbate, Chlorophyllin)……………… 23 mg 210 mg 50%
Manganese (Glycinate)………………………………… 256 mcg 2.3 mg 100%
Molybdenum (Na Molybdate) ………………………… 5 mcg 45 mcg 100%
Selenium (Se-Methylselenocysteine) ………………….. 22 mcg 200 mcg 364%
Silicon (Na Metasilicate)……………………………….. 5.5 mg 50 mg *
Strontium (Citrate)……………………………………… 167 mcg 1.5 mg *
Vanadium (Citrate)……………………………………... 2 mcg 18 mcg *
Zinc (Citrate)…………………………………………… 1 mg 11 mg 100%

Biotransformation Conjugates
Acetic acid……………………………………………… 11 mg 100 mg *
Glycine………………………………………………… 44 mg 400 mg *
Taurine………………………………………………… 56 mg 500 mg *
Trimethylglycine (TMG) HCl …………………………… 56 mg 500 mg *
N-Acetylcysteine (NAC)……………………………….. 22 mg 200 mg 10%
*Dietary Reference Intake not established. Sources: Tocopherols: soy. Tocotrienols: palm.
Other ingredients: <3% corn starch, gelatin, ~0.4% soy and vegetable oil, ~0.3% sucrose, silicon dioxide, calcium phosphate, maltodextrin, Acacia gum, ascorbyl palmitate, sorbitan monostearate, gum Arabic, < 0.003% coconut oil, dl-alpha tocopherol.

To your health!

AOR

[lynx]

Nice formula!

Put Life Extension on notice to remove the niacinamide. Also, that is a generous dose of Sulforaphane, must be expensive.

I want to buy isolated Pyrroloquinoline quinone, you gonna sell it?

[lemon]

Vitamin A and BoNE

Concerns for Cancer Patients
Reports of increased bone fracture risk are a concern when higher potency vitamin A supplements are taken over the long-term (Michaelsson et al. 2003). One study showed bone mineral density was reduced by 10 percent in those taking more than 5000 IU of vitamin A from both dietary sources and supplements. This study showed that compared to lower intakes of vitamin A, those taking more than 5000 IU of vitamin A had a 2.1 time higher risk of hip fracture.

One reason people take vitamin A supplements is to reduce cancer risk. What these bone density/fracture studies fail to ascertain is whether the same people taking higher doses of vitamin A had lower incidences of cancer. These studies also fail to establish whether the study participants were taking adequate amounts of bone-protecting nutrients such as manganese, zinc, copper, vitamin K, and magnesium. It could be that people consuming lots of vitamin A-fortified milk and eating vitamin A-rich organ meats had deficiencies of other nutrients critical to bone maintenance. One of these nutrients is folic acid, which lowers homocysteine levels. Excess homocysteine participates in degenerative bone degradation.

From a practical standpoint, a healthy person is left with some unanswered questions. A plethora of published studies associates low vitamin A intake with increased cancer risk (see Reference list for Appendix A). Guarding against vitamin A deficiency is thus a critical component of a cancer prevention program. It would therefore appear practical to supplement with 5000 IU a day of vitamin A, but perhaps higher doses are not needed. In fact, taking higher doses of vitamin A over an extended time period without other bone-protecting nutrients would appear to increase fracture risk. Refer to the Osteoporosis protocol for complete details about the steps you can take to protect against the loss of bone mineral density and subsequent risk of fracture.

Life Extension's Super Booster contains mixed tocopherols, 10 additional mg of Lycopene delivered in an oil base among a list of many ingredients. Super Booster is strongly encouraged to Life Extension foundation members because Life Extension Mix is dry powder only.

Life Extention Mix can be purchased with high or low dose Niacin if one is concerned.

I believe it is ignorant to ignore Green Tea's ability to combat heart disease, cancer, tooth decay and arthritis.

So AORSupport, how much did you have to give ImmInst.org to peddle your products here? LOL! [lol]

[zg00]

AORsupport, the one thing that confounds me everything I visit your website is the seemingly missing price and buy button. I must be missing something, but for the life of me I can't figure out how to buy anything.

?

[scottl]

Nerve (is that you?),

Like many supplement suppliers, they do not sell direct to the public. The same would be true if you visited the website of Jarrow, twinlab....

For best prices try froogle for any AOR product.

[strongman]

I agree, LEF tends to throw a bunch of stuff into their forumulations without really thinking about the interactions. AOR's forumulation looks much better.

[lemon]

Possible side effects and precautions

Green tea, even in large amounts, is associated with very few side effects. In mice, signs of toxicity were only observed when doses reached 2 g/kg daily of an 80% polyphenol abstract (this is about the equivalent of 8 cups per pound of body weight, per day – 1200 cups of tea in a 150 lb. individual) [80].

It is possible that large amounts of polyphenols could impair mineral absorption, making extra mineral supplements a wise course of action. Of primary importance is a significant inhibition of nonheme iron absorption, which is relevant if most of your iron comes from sources other than meat [81, 82]. It is possible that there is also mild inhibition of calcium, manganese, and zinc [83, 84], although there is a study that disputes the finding of impaired zinc absorption [84]. The only place where the phenomenon of significant mineral blockage by green tea has even been of worry is in Tunisia, where there is high tea intake and non-meat products are the primary source of dietay iron [81]. However, it may be prudent to take a multivitamin supplement that provides adequate amounts of these minerals at a separate time or a low-dose slow release iron supplement if one decides to consume large amounts of polyphenols.

Life Extension Mix does indeed have extra zinc and manganese in their formula.

Once again the overwhelming body of evidence states that green tea has significant health promoting effects.

[ageless]

Wow. AOR great formula. Balanced nicely with the best forms and doses I've seen yet in a multi. I thought LEF's multi was good, but had flaws that along with the price kept me away. Looking forward to Ortho Core.

[Trias]

Thank you, AOR, for the detailed and prompt response!

No doubt, - I will give Ortho-Core a try - - looks truly awesome and promising!
But that depends on the price naturally, as my resources are not limitless... :-\

What do you (AORsupport) think of Pharmanex's Lifepak (I'm currently using it) ?

Forever!
Daniel

[zg00]

Nerve (is that you?),

Like many supplement suppliers, they do not sell direct to the public.  The same would be true if you visited the website of Jarrow, twinlab....

For best prices try froogle for any AOR product.

Thanks Scott, I hadn't realized they were only manufacturers.

[Yosi]

Thank you, AOR, for the detailed and prompt response!

No doubt, - I will give Ortho-Core a try - - looks truly awesome and promising!
But that depends on the price naturally, as my resources are not limitless...  :-\

What do you (AORsupport) think of Pharmanex's Lifepak (I'm currently using it) ?

Forever!
Daniel

Daniel,

I think that AORSupport gave some very good pointers in his message to possible problems with different MVs. I suggest you go through that list and see if anything is applicable to the MV you are using.

As for AOR OC, I can attest that cheap it is not. Maybe you should consider AOR's essential mix instead?

hope this helps,
Yosi

[strongman]

Going over the AOR essential mix forumla again I notice a few things that might give me problems.

NAC for one, it makes me lose hair for some reason, also Indole-3-Carbinol.

Those are great anti-oxidants however both seem to make me lose hair. I have played extensively with supp's and have noticed that some make me prone to slight hair loss.

The NAC hairloss has been reported on usenet newsgroups as well, not sure about I-3-C but since it mucks with the testosterone/estrogren balance I believe that is what does it. It throws my system of of hormonal balance and seems to cause hairloss.
Just want to post this here so maybe you guys will take notice of this, as I dont think many vitamin manufacturers are aware there can be the problem of hairloss in prone individuals with these vitamins.

Probably most users dont realize it either unless they pay special attention to the supp's they take and their side effects.

[ageless]

The total dose of NAC is only 200mg which to me seems like just enough for benefit, while not nearly enough to cause any side effects. Remember that is with 9 caps/day so you could always take less. Just a thought.

[eternaltraveler]

AOR the essential mix would be great if I could find anywhere that sells it

[chelovd]

Hi,

I'm tempted to buy it from this Canadian supplier: http://www.globalvit...t... page 2.htm

what do you think?

[eternaltraveler]

http://www.aor.ca/

elrond, on the left bar, the third box down it says "From Where to Buy". In that box you can "enter a city name or a postal code" and it lists the stores in your area.

Been there, done that. Couldn't find a US supplier. Even the websites it listed didn't actually have it on their order pages when I clicked through and looked around.

[scottl]

Why not call AOR and ask them?

[eternaltraveler]

I was more or less waiting for AOR to respond to this thread. I'm in no hurry. I have plenty of non conviently mixed supplements to use up for the next couple months anyway.

[AORsupport]

[quote]
Nice formula! [/quote]
[quote]
Wow. AOR great formula. Balanced nicely with the best forms and doses I've seen yet in a multi. I thought LEF's multi was good, but had flaws that along with the price kept me away. Looking forward to Ortho Core.[/quote]
Thanks -- we aim to please .
[quote]
Put Life Extension on notice to remove the niacinamide.[/quote]
And the retinol: Paul Wakfer alerted them to this years ago, and still no action.

[quote]
Also, that is a generous dose of Sulforaphane, must be expensive.[/quote]
Many of the ingredients are, unfortunately.
[quote]
I want to buy isolated Pyrroloquinoline quinone, you gonna sell it?[/quote]

Probably not isolated, but it will be in at least 1 other formula (which is hush-hush at the moment); maybe that will mesh well with your needs if for some Ortho Core doesn't quite meet your needs.

[quote]
Life Extension's Super Booster contains mixed tocopherols,[/quote]

First, AOR's formulating principle is that supplements should be designed not to have internal flaws which need secondary correction via a separate supplement in the first place.

Second, the total tocopherols in Super Booster come to 359 mg, of which ~54 will be more alpha-tocopherol, and there are no tocotrienols. One would need 2-3 of these a day just to counterbalance the effects on tocopherols from the 400 IU present in LEF Mix, and tocotrienols would still be being driven out of a user's system.

[quote]
10 additional mg of Lycopene delivered in an oil base among a list of many ingredients.[/quote]

That's fine for Super Booster, but then why bother with the irrelevant 3 mg in LEF Mix, except to have it nominally present on the label?

[quote]
Life Extention Mix can be purchased with high or low dose Niacin if one is concerned.[/quote]

Ah -- hadn't seen that. Good point.

[quote]
[Regarding inhibition of mineral absorption by green tea extract,] Life Extension Mix does indeed have extra zinc and manganese in their formula.

I believe it is ignorant to ignore Green Tea's ability to combat heart disease, cancer, tooth decay and arthritis.[/quote]

I certainly agree on the importance of taking green tea and/or its extract (although note that the benefits for tooth decay (via inhibiting gingival bacteria) are not yet really proven, and in any case would only apply if you drink the stuff so that you get topical exposure). I'm simply pointing out that it shouldn't be mixed in with a multivitamin. Again, AOR's formulating principle is that supplements should be designed not to have internal flaws which need secondary overcorrection via a overdosing of other ingredients in the first place, especially as the degree of inhibition will vary from person to person.

A separate EGCG-standardized green tea pill (or, of course, the beverage itself, as 10 cups/day of Japanese sencha) taken between meals gives you green tea's benefits without messing with mineral absorption.

[quote]
What do you (AORsupport) think of Pharmanex's Lifepak (I'm currently using it) ?[/quote]

It shares a lot of the same flaws, as Yosi noted.

[quote]
The NAC hairloss has been reported on usenet newsgroups as well, not sure about I-3-C but since it mucks with the testosterone/estrogren balance I believe that is what does it. It throws my system of of hormonal balance and seems to cause hairloss.[/quote]

As ageless suggests, " The total dose of NAC is only 200mg which to me seems like just enough for benefit, while not nearly enough to cause any side effects." Similarly, 20 mg I3C is a very conservative dose: in line with epidemiological, high-quintile Brassica consumption, but still an order of magnitude lower than is used for respiratory papillomatosis or cervical intraepithelial neoplasia. I am quite confident that these doses should pose no problems on hair. (Also, I'd be surprised if I3C caused hair loss, at least if it's due to male pattern baldness: there is no upregulation of testosterone production or conversion into DHT).

Also as ageless suggests, "Remember that is with 9 caps/day so you could always take less." Indeed, few people should be taking a full daily dose of almost any premium multivitamin: 9 caps of Ortho Core covers your needs for all essential nutrients, and many important constituents of a healthy diet, but presumably you are also consuming some food .

[quote]
AOR the essential mix would be great if I could find anywhere that sells it [/quote]

Heh. I assume that you are in the United States. Sorry 'bout that: blame the FDA's new bioterrorism bureaucracy, which greatly delays the first[i] shipment of [i]all foods and supplements across the border. As I'd mentioned in a previous thread, Essential Mix is brand new and is as yet only available in Canada. It should be available in the USA by the end of this month, at which point individual stores have to order it for their own stock before they can offer it to their customers. Also there may be some delay between a store having it in stock and them putting it up on their website, so it is probably a good idea to call and check. If nothing else, a store might be reminded/encouraged to pick it up more quickly by that very fact.

Also, a beta version of OrthoCore (one key formulation difference: it lacked the PQQ) with a primitive label is available now in the USA from Lynn Martin: dayrain [ATSIGN] earthlink.net .

[quote]
I was more or less waiting for AOR to respond to this thread. [/quote]

Sorry to keep you waiting! Recent changes mean that I will not be actively monitoring the Forums very much any more; folks with questions may want to email Tech [ATSIGN] AOR.ca to ensure a quick response.

To your health!

AOR

[AORsupport]

[quote]
Nice formula! [/quote]
[quote]
Wow. AOR great formula. Balanced nicely with the best forms and doses I've seen yet in a multi. I thought LEF's multi was good, but had flaws that along with the price kept me away. Looking forward to Ortho Core.[/quote]
Thanks -- we aim to please .
[quote]
Put Life Extension on notice to remove the niacinamide.[/quote]
And the retinol: Paul Wakfer alerted them to this years ago, and still no action.

[quote]
Also, that is a generous dose of Sulforaphane, must be expensive.[/quote]
Many of the ingredients are, unfortunately.
[quote]
I want to buy isolated Pyrroloquinoline quinone, you gonna sell it?[/quote]

Probably not isolated, but it will be in at least 1 other formula (which is hush-hush at the moment); maybe that will mesh well with your needs if for some Ortho Core doesn't quite meet your needs.

[quote]
Life Extension's Super Booster contains mixed tocopherols,[/quote]

First, AOR's formulating principle is that supplements should be designed not to have internal flaws which need secondary correction via a separate supplement in the first place.

Second, the total tocopherols in Super Booster come to 359 mg, of which ~54 will be more alpha-tocopherol, and there are no tocotrienols. One would need 2-3 of these a day just to counterbalance the effects on tocopherols from the 400 IU present in LEF Mix, and tocotrienols would still be being driven out of a user's system.

[quote]
10 additional mg of Lycopene delivered in an oil base among a list of many ingredients.[/quote]

That's fine for Super Booster, but then why bother with the irrelevant 3 mg in LEF Mix, except to have it nominally present on the label?

[quote]
Life Extention Mix can be purchased with high or low dose Niacin if one is concerned.[/quote]

Ah -- hadn't seen that. Good point.

[quote]
[Regarding inhibition of mineral absorption by green tea extract,] Life Extension Mix does indeed have extra zinc and manganese in their formula.

I believe it is ignorant to ignore Green Tea's ability to combat heart disease, cancer, tooth decay and arthritis.[/quote]

I certainly agree on the importance of taking green tea and/or its extract (although note that the benefits for tooth decay (via inhibiting gingival bacteria) are not yet really proven, and in any case would only apply if you drink the stuff so that you get topical exposure). I'm simply pointing out that it shouldn't be mixed in with a multivitamin. Again, AOR's formulating principle is that supplements should be designed not to have internal flaws which need secondary overcorrection via a overdosing of other ingredients in the first place, especially as the degree of inhibition will vary from person to person.

A separate EGCG-standardized green tea pill (or, of course, the beverage itself, as 10 cups/day of Japanese sencha) taken between meals gives you green tea's benefits without messing with mineral absorption.

[quote]
What do you (AORsupport) think of Pharmanex's Lifepak (I'm currently using it) ?[/quote]

It shares a lot of the same flaws, as Yosi noted.

[quote]
The NAC hairloss has been reported on usenet newsgroups as well, not sure about I-3-C but since it mucks with the testosterone/estrogren balance I believe that is what does it. It throws my system of of hormonal balance and seems to cause hairloss.[/quote]

As ageless suggests, " The total dose of NAC is only 200mg which to me seems like just enough for benefit, while not nearly enough to cause any side effects." Similarly, 20 mg I3C is a very conservative dose: in line with epidemiological, high-quintile Brassica consumption, but still an order of magnitude lower than is used for respiratory papillomatosis or cervical intraepithelial neoplasia. I am quite confident that these doses should pose no problems on hair. (Also, I'd be surprised if I3C caused hair loss, at least if it's due to male pattern baldness: there is no upregulation of testosterone production or conversion into DHT).

Also as ageless suggests, "Remember that is with 9 caps/day so you could always take less." Indeed, few people should be taking a full daily dose of almost any premium multivitamin: 9 caps of Ortho Core covers your needs for all essential nutrients, and many important constituents of a healthy diet, but presumably you are also consuming some food .

[quote]
AOR the essential mix would be great if I could find anywhere that sells it [/quote]

Heh. I assume that you are in the United States. Sorry 'bout that: blame the FDA's new bioterrorism bureaucracy, which greatly delays the first shipment of all foods and supplements across the border. As I'd mentioned in a previous thread, Essential Mix is brand new and is as yet only available in Canada. It should be available in the USA by the end of this month, at which point individual stores have to order it for their own stock before they can offer it to their customers. Also there may be some delay between a store having it in stock and them putting it up on their website, so it is probably a good idea to call and check. If nothing else, a store might be reminded/encouraged to pick it up more quickly by that very fact.

Also, a beta version of OrthoCore (one key formulation difference: it lacked the PQQ) with a primitive label is available now in the USA from Lynn Martin: dayrain [ATSIGN] earthlink.net .

[quote]
I was more or less waiting for AOR to respond to this thread. [/quote]

Sorry to keep you waiting! Recent changes mean that I will not be actively monitoring the Forums very much any more; folks with questions may want to email Tech [ATSIGN] AOR.ca to ensure a quick response.

To your health!

AOR

[chelovd]

Thanks for your thorough replies AOR. I placed my order with a Canadian supplier: www.globalvitamins.ca. I let you know about the experience...

[psychenaut]

You can keep an eye here RelentlessImprovement.com for Essential Mix and ORTHO•CORE availability. There is also a browsable section by AOR product.

Edited by psychenaut, 17 February 2005 - 02:23 PM.

[Pablo M]

What about the sucralose content? I've read some bad things.

[wannafulfill]

Can someone give us a rough idea of pills/bottle and pricing for this awesome multi?

EDIT - I found some things out.

Price: $44.95 from relentless improvement available starting mid-April '05

270 capsules

9 capsules to a full serving

so, 30 day supply

Edited by wannafulfill, 04 April 2005 - 08:05 AM.

[psychenaut]

Hi wanna-

Latest word from AOR yesterday (Mon 4/4) is that we should get stock in about 2 weeks. Minor adjustments are being made to labeling so as to speed it through FDA/US Customs. Keep an eye on the Ortho Core Page for updates. Orders can be placed now to reserve your portion of the initial order.

As I reviewed the ingredients again myself, I am even more impressed with the formulation. Truly oriented toward the serious life-extensionist.

Don't forget the popular and tasty Essential Mix Powder is available for shipping today. Retail is $30 so at $24.95 we remain well under the market.

[wannafulfill]

As I reviewed the ingredients again myself, I am even more impressed with the formulation. Truly oriented toward the serious life-extensionist.

Thanks and yeah, based on the ingredients, it's the best single supp I've seen. I have about a months supply of my current multi's, so I will order when once it's in stock.

[johnmk]

I agree. The price is high though but for some/many, worth paying.

[johnmk]

I'm buying this product now. While I don't mind paying $45/mo. for this I am interested in finding it cheaper or in bulk. Any help here?

-John