Rebutting xanadu's personal attacks on me

I don't know any facts in this case and am saddened that someone of LM's stature would be forced to leave or involuntarily stripped of his rank. I do know, as many others of us know, that there is a malicious troll on this board. He uses many many names and creates a new one almost every week. He has attacked me and others under a number of those names. I would not be at all surprised if all of them were this adam character who appears to be tradewinds today. He has carried out his mission of sowing dissention and disruption on imminst. Can't anyone stop him?

Looks like the matter has been settled. LM has proven his identity and that he has an MD. Several members have attested to the fact they met him in real life at the place he says he works. He has offered so fax his credentials and people have taken him up on it. What is left to discuss? Only thing remaining is a bunch of newly registered trolls, obvioulsy Adam himself. I believe he is the troll who has been infesting this site with misinformation and malice for some time. He has attacked me among others.

I say restore LM to his former status posthaste, that is if he is still willing to stay. Please stay on, LM, you are a valuable member and source of info. If you won't take back your advisor status, at least post from time to time though I hope to see you here as much as before. Don't let this incident sour you on everything else. Adam is apparently very crafty in the ways of manipulation and we can't blame the people he confused.

Just my 2 cents worth.

I'm kinda shocked that LM is still having to defend himself against these accusations after they have basicly been put to rest. He's proven his identity and his MD, even Adam seems to admit that. The rest is childish bickering. I sure would not want to be a moderator on this site after seeing what some of them have to go through. If there were questions about his credentials, that should have been settled before he was given his position, not brought up again later. Is he going to have to defend himself against the same or similar charges again and again indefinately? This is nothing but harrassment. Leadership should declare it ended and ask LM to take back his advisor role.

It's interesting how LM is "invited" to respond while at the same time he is banned from posting. Doesn't anyone see the irony in all this? I'm trying to think of some place that does this but I'm not sure. Maybe the old soviet union under stalin they might have done trials like that. I can't even see stalin inviting someone to respond while they had a gag on them. Not if everyone could see and knew the person was gagged. People might laugh out loud but here everyone is serious. He is invited to defend himself but he can't post. He has to hope someone else will post for him. I do not represent LM. I havent spoken with him nor gotten any pm's. I just think this is totally unfair. It's like a show trial in nazi germany or stalin's soviet union. Or the trial in Alice in Wonderland.

At least restore his posting privileges for a few days to respond. How can you have a proper show trial without at least that? I'm sure I'm not the only person to be wondering about these things. If you want any credibility to remain in this process, he has to be allowed to speak. Otherwise it's a farce

funkodyssey wrote:

"LM = Edward Younan"

And how do you know this? Because of spelling errors or something like that? I'm just trying to sift through all this to find out if there is any solid evidence at all. I'm open to the possibility that LM is not Lee Crost and doesn't have an MD. However, the "proof" of that seems to be a phone call in which someone saying he was Crost denied being LM. Besides that phone call all there seems to be are spelling errors and writing style.

Steve Sliwa now is claimed to be LM based on what, spelling errors? You don't even have a phone call to back that up. And how do you know the one you talked to at Sherwyn's was L Crost? All you have is a voice on the phone. And for that he is called a fraud, accused of identity theft and many other accusations and banned? The proof against Steve is even less than that.

It seems that the $500 LM paid for a lifetime membership is going to be pocketed and his membership revoked. Do you think that anyone else will pay for a lifetime membership after that little move? Do you think it will help or hinder money raising? Try to get a tax deduction for your $50 a year imminst membership. I don't believe the irs considers a membership to be a contribution and the wording on this site does not indicate that. It's payment for a membership. LM paid and got nothing.

I asked what rule LM broke and where that rule is written. It's considered bad form to make up a rule after the fact and then accuse someone of breaking it. No one has given an answer to that or any of the other questions I've asked. All I've seen in the way of proof is a phone call and a lot of speculation. I suppose I'll be banned now for asking too many embarrassing questions. The unwritten rule seems to be that disagreeing with the directors is not allowed.

I was called a professional troll by jay for asking questions and taking LM's side. Steve is threatened with banning and was libeled for doing nothing but sticking up for his friend. LM isn't even my friend, I just tend to root for the underdog and think it's terribly unfair that he isn't even allowed to defend himself any longer. I never saw LM claim to be a doctor so how is that an issue? Steve is the only one allowed to speak for LM and he has not indicated he wants to be that conduit. He has said he is done with this. So I guess now you will say LM "had his chance" to reply through Steve and blew it. I guess you will pat yourselves on the back over how fair you were even though there was no fairness here at all. If I'm wrong, show me the proof LM lied about who he is? Show me where he said he was a doctor in the first place? If he had, someone would have posted a link to the thread.

Thank you, Mind, for having given us some substance to work with

"Edward Younan paid for LM's account.
Steve Sliwa registerd the LM account.
Edward and Steve both claim to be president of Uniquenutrition
Uniquenutrition's IP address has been identical to LM's on several occasions."

I didn't know that and I doubt that many of the regular members knew it either. That does indicate LM and Steve worked closely together but that is not a crime. One could speculate that LM and Steve are the same person but their writing styles are very different so I doubt it.

"Edward has used the "LifeMirage" name in other forums.
Abusive spam accounts (defenders of LM) were registered using UN's address."

How do you know this? You are not in a position to see IP numbers for forums not at Imminst. Nor are you in a position to see other private info on other forums. This sounds like hearsay.

"LM abused moderation powers by deleting dozens (maybe over a hundred) of old incriminating posts, among other infractions."

How do you know they were incriminating if they are gone? Do you have copies?

"At least three people talked to Lee and he denied being LM. I also talked to the Sherwyn's staff to confirm this series of events."

"LM allowed people to think he was a doctor in his "LifeMirage anti-aging and nootropic regimen" thread. When asked to clear it up, he wouldn't until after 4 weeks. This "misrepresenting" thread will be published soon, although LM did delete some of it before it was archived."

Allowing people to think what they want is not the same as claiming to be a doctor. I've never seen any posts where LM claimed to have an MD or be a doctor. Telling leadership in private that he had an MD, if he indeed said that, is grounds for taking away his advisor status. I see no reason for the nasty personal attacks he has suffered nor for the move to ban him. If he never told us, the general members, that he was a doctor, why should he be banned if it turns out he is not a doctor?

Is it a violation of the rules for 2 people to share an account? Where are the rules he violated? Is it a violation of the rules to let people think what they want? I simply do not see where LM hurt anybody. Leadership is implying he either defrauded people out of something or hurt people. I never saw him do it.

How can you accept money for a lifetime membership, keep the money and revoke the membership? One or the other must be returned to LM or whoever paid for it. Taking money on false pretenses is fraud right there. I'm not saying Imminst commited fraud but statements by certain directors and others indicates that is about to happen. Hopefully, it will not happen.

I just want to see fairness brought into this whole debacle.

"Then apparently you need to do more research before defending this charlatan."

Why is it no one has given a link to such a post (having MD)? No one has stated they remember him saying it either.

Using the word "patients" does not mean he's a doctor. A diet councilor might refer to his clients as patients. Not replying to a direct question about if he is a doctor is not the same as claiming to be one. What scott or others said is not relevent to what LM claimed to be. You haven't shown that he claimed to be a doctor or that he told the public he had an MD.

If he said "my fellow MD's" then that implies a doctor but he did not come out and say it. Besides, you haven't proven he doesn't have an MD. You don't know for sure who he is. You are going by hearsay.

Where is the rule written that he broke? I never saw a rule saying that if you let people think you are a doctor, you have to be a doctor or be banned. People might think I'm the governor of Maryland. I'll just let them think what they want. My fellow governors...

" A signed confession..."

Or at least tell us what rule he broke and how you proved it. Phone conversations are hearsay and you don't know for sure who you spoke to.

" LifeMirage is banned for one year. After that, he can have his membership restored to its lifetime status."

Banned for a phone call, for implying he had an MD, or for being friends with Steve? And Steve is going to be banned for being friends with LM and/or using the same account? Is that in the rules? What other hidden rules are there that we don't know about? I just want to get the facts straight.

Adam, I never attacked you at any time. I pointed out a long time back that you were trolling under new names but everyone knew that. Not an attack, just an observation. And what has dredging up LM to do with this conversation?

Adam, the "personal attacks" were issued months ago, and in completely different circumstances. They have no current relevance, other than you holding a grudge on xanadu because of them. Unfortunately, ImmInst WILL NOT endorse personal wars or flaming.

In future you guys will have to solve your disagreements on whatever issues you have with logic and argumentation, not ad hominem attacks.

This thread is going to the catcher.

I missed Guiding Light on Friday. Thanks for the woman drama.

It would be in keeping with this spirit if past differences were regarded as forgiven.

Where'd you get that pic, and is it public domain?

You're right Jay, something about it really cracks me up.

Chances are most pics one comes across may be found via Google Images.

stow away on the boat to New Zealand and start over

I never see you knock anyone else let alone babble about heavy metals. You give us both sides of the picture, not just hype to boost sales.